When can I start structuring my bonsai?

[mopifish]

Hi everyone! I'm new to the forum and bonsai as a whole.

I just bought a creeping juniper (juniperus horizontalis) from my local nursery with some help from the nursery's bonsai enthusiast.
I already pinched off all of the dead and brittle leaves/branches, as well as snipped a few tiny branches from the lower trunk as an indulgence, but I stopped for fear of pruning.

When can I start "cleaning" or structurally pruning my new bonsai? Is it okay to start now, or is it best to do it in another season?

I know bonsai is all about patience, but it has a lot of awesome branches I can't wait to reveal!

 

[pandacular]

First off, welcome! This is an incredible resource for learning about bonsai. I recommend going to the resources section and finding the one about progression threads; there you'll see how others have grown out there bonsai.

You should also add your location and USDA hardiness zone on your profile so other users can know when they read your posts.

I say go for it now! Have some fun with it, and once you're done pruning and branch selecting, pay attention to how it responds with new growth. Junipers like this one often actually grow out quite a lot after a prune. If you're interested in learning why, I recommend reading about the hormones auxin and cytokinin. There are some great Bonsai Mirai videos in the free BSOP series on YouTube about this.

When can I start "cleaning" or structurally pruning my new bonsai? Is it okay to start now, or is it best to do it in another season?

The important thing with timing stuff like this is to spread out work, and let the tree recover. If you want to repot in spring and that's your highest priority, you should only prune lightly now. I'd recommend holding off on a repot this spring and doing a big prune now, and once you've had some time to look at the tree, add some wire to it in the early fall.

I'd also recommend trimming down the sides of that pot a little to let some light hit the bottom of the tree and make it easier to work. Often, nursery trees like this are potted very low in the soil, with their trunk buried some. You could look into a doing a process called a "sumi" which is kinda like repotting just the top of the soil in order to get an idea of where the roots start. But always remember, listen to how your tree responds to your work before doing more. A young tree like that should recover quickly and put out lots of new growth after operations in the growing season, and if it doesn't, just let it relax.

 

[pandacular]

Out of curiosity, what resources are you using to learn bonsai? YouTube has a lot of good and quite a lot of bad. I'm a big fan of the channel Growing Bonsai with Jelle (featuring our very own @ leatherback!) as he provides an excellent overview of all aspects of bonsai while working mostly on trees in the realm of reality for beginners. A lot of the big name pro artists who publish content (Bonsai Mirai, Eisei-en) have awesome stuff but on trees in a completely different world than stuff beginners like us are likely to find.

If you're interested in classes in person, there is a shop in Seattle that I can recommend. You should also try to get involved in your local bonsai club...not that I have yet, but I'm looking forward to it

 

[mopifish]

this is such awesome advice! Thanks so much
I especially appreciate the help in getting me setup with the forum, though I expect it'll be a while before I fully understand USDA zones lol

I'm definitely getting started on trimming tonight, and will be scrolling through a ton of those progress forums (as soon as I find out where theyre at).

I first got interested in bonsai from videos by Herons Bonsai, and mostly have just been watching videos from him.
I also got a lot of advice from the guy at my nursery when buying, and he recommended a few channels too (Bonsai Mirai, Bonsai Empire, and Bonsai Fly) and I've spent most of the day reading articles about juniper bonsai care!

I live about 2 hours from Seattle, so I'll totally take that shop recommendation! I don't know if my city has a Bonsai club, but I also hadn't thought about it, so I'll definitely look into it

I really appreciate the warm welcome, it has me so excited!

 

[mopifish]

I went out and cleaned it up by mostly revealing the trunk/branches, and removing a few small errant branches that I couldn't imagine being useful!
That gorgeous swoop it has looks like it would lend to a semi-cascade really well, but I'm still holding off on making any big structural decisions.

(partly due to indecision, and partly due to worry for the plant!)

 

[pandacular]

I live about 2 hours from Seattle, so I'll totally take that shop recommendation!

The shop is called Heartwoods Bonsai. The beginners lessons are a series of three, seasonally timed lessons and they run about 3-4 hours long. Definitely would get your times worth for the drive, but there's a better chance than you might expect that there's a local club or place to take a class.

other bonsai destinations in the Puget Sound are the Pacific Bonsai Museum in Federal Way (a MUST SEE!), Dan Robinson's Elandan Gardens in Bremerton, Bonsai Northwest and Asia Pacific Gardening, both other shops. Unfortunately, most of that stuff is south of Seattle, but we do live in a lovely place for bonsai.

I first got interested in bonsai from videos by Herons Bonsai, and mostly have just been watching videos from him.

You'll likely find that people on this forum don't think overly highly of Peter's technique or presentation style. One thing to always look for in bonsai educational material is whether they show the end result. I think you'll notice that Peter rarely does. I think he has skills, but is more focused on selling trees. And that's not such a bad thing, but it doesn't make for the best educational content.

 

[pandacular]

Really nice job exposing the trunk line and main branching. You should find some pruning theory videos to watch, but my basic advice is to keep going with your pruning into the smaller branches, looking for and removing the following:
* tops, or growth coming out of the top of a branch
* bottoms
* crotches, pieces of growth coming out of the point where two branches divide
* bar branches, where two pieces grow opposite one another.

Do this across the smaller branches, going down recursively into the even finer stuff.

You'll want to aim for a broadly alternate growth on the branches. When in doubt, don't overdo your cutting this time of year for horticultural reasons, but I find that I rarely regret cuts I make from a design perspective.

Speaking of perspective, remember that what is a top, bottom, left or right is a matter of perspective. You can easily roll a branch with wire if you find it's mostly tops and bottoms and no lefts and rights. Also you'll find that making you don't necessarily have to remove the "obvious" piece to get the right structure. for example, if you're at a tip with three pieces where you need two, the middle one might not be the best one to cut!

 

[River's Edge]

I went out and cleaned it up by mostly revealing the trunk/branches, and removing a few small errant branches that I couldn't imagine being useful!
That gorgeous swoop it has looks like it would lend to a semi-cascade really well, but I'm still holding off on making any big structural decisions.

(partly due to indecision, and partly due to worry for the plant!)


View attachment 499427

A slower approach would give you a faster result. One should retain most of the inner shoots ( secondary branches) on primary branches closest to the trunk for design, ok to clean out crotches and weak upper or lower growth. It saves having to work on back budding to regrow the inner sections. In this case I would have grown out the trunk before reducing the inner branching. Thinning them to a certain extent is ok but best not remove and leave sections of bare branching. It is a matter of proportion, between trunk size, branching and spacing of foliage. Not to worry long term, with proper care this species will bud back readily.
Typically with Bonsai you are working to compact foliage and keep it to the interior, not develop or focus it on the outside of the branching.Also retaining more foliage would thicken the trunk faster at this stage off development.
Just some thoughts for next time! If you are interested an excellent resource for Junipers is the book " Masters Series Junipers " Bonsai Today. Was available through Stone Lantern Publishing. The focus is on growing & styling juniper bonsai. Shimpaku, Needle, Procumbens, California and other junipers.
The diagrams show good before and after examples of pruning and developmental sequences to follow.

 

[mopifish]

A slower approach would give you a faster result.

It's sounding like this is the core of Bonsai really!
It seems I was a bit too eager to see some sort of bonsai form but I'm okay with that as long as the tree is okay

I really appreciated pandaculars philosophy of "try something, and see how the plant reacts".
I always learn best when I fail first, and then get tips from others on how to improve.

Just some thoughts for next time!

I think it'd be really interesting to get a second juniper, and try out these methods instead just to see the difference in how the plants grow and react.
Thank you for the tips! If I get more Junipers (which is seeming likely...) I'll definitely check out that book

 

[River's Edge]

It's sounding like this is the core of Bonsai really!
It seems I was a bit too eager to see some sort of bonsai form but I'm okay with that as long as the tree is okay

I really appreciated pandaculars philosophy of "try something, and see how the plant reacts".
I always learn best when I fail first, and then get tips from others on how to improve.

I think it'd be really interesting to get a second juniper, and try out these methods instead just to see the difference in how the plants grow and react.
Thank you for the tips! If I get more Junipers (which is seeming likely...) I'll definitely check out that book

Your welcome, not to be discouraged the tree can easily recover and it is not hard to correct. Once the branches back bud closer in you can cut back to the closer in side branches and improve the bare sections creating a more compact design and better proportion between the trunk and primary branching.

 

[pandacular]

If you are interested an excellent resource for Junipers is the book " Masters Series Junipers " Bonsai Today. Was available through Stone Lantern Publishing. The focus is on growing & styling juniper bonsai. Shimpaku, Needle, Procumbens, California and other junipers.

Frank beat me to it but I was about to recommend this and a couple other books!

I just organized my bookshelf--proof that we both had some great plans for Friday note, by my style--and was going to briefly talk about each of them. Most are from Stone Lantern who is ALWAYS running sales and i can recommend as an online store in addition to their role as a bonsai publisher.

In order of how much I like/recommend them:

Principles of Bonsai Design by David de Groot
Truly a masterpiece, and considered by many the most complete book on the art of bonsai design and display. Won't tell you much about technical or horticultural aspects of bonsai, so I'd recommend having another book when starting out, but for what it does, it's hard to beat.

Bonsai Today Masters' Series Junipers/Pines
Nothing more to add; get the junipers one, then grab the pines one once you want to get a pine

Foundations of Bonsai by Harry Harrington
Really solid all encompassing book. There's a few things that seem off to me, like recommending auto-watering systems, but like anything, you'll find a mix of things that work for people. (aside: always be questioning if advice people give you makes sense. plurality of opinions is key)

The Little Book of Bonsai
This one might be higher when I finish getting through it. I was too transfixed with the photography and trees to really read it. Just kidding, I've used as a reference on sections, but having read it cover to cover yet. But I do love this one for it's superb trees and photography, which is one of the most important things.


Introduction to Bonsai by the editors of Bonsai Sekai
My first bonsai book, and an interesting one. It has a brief primer on somewhat scattered technique and anesthetics. Its organized as a species guide in the back half, with fully illustrated little articles (reprints from old magazines? I'm unsure) and breif care details. I wouldn't highly recommend it, as it tells you a lot of WHAT to do and no WHY you would do it in the first place, but still worth it since I found at Uwajimaya of all places.

Bonsai: 101 Essential Tips by Harry Tomlinson
I got this for $5 and don't even feel it was worth that. Most the trees are ugly and poorly photographed, and the organization really doesn't make sense. The "tips" are a mix of info and technique, both of which are a mixed bag.

Also in my collection is Trees of Washington, published by the Wazzu Extension School, and The Reference Manual of Woody Plant Propagation by Dirr and Heuser. The former is a MUST HAVE if you want to identify native trees. and it's $9, which is probably not more than the price to print and distribute it. (I'm a big fan of our public universities). I found mine at REI which felt very cool cause I'll definitely take it on hikes.

This ended up being a long post, but I'd also recommend at least one book that's just a collection of really beautiful trees. I have a book of Kokufu winners from when I went to Japan, but there's plenty of other ones, and lots of times big shows will publish free online versions which are also good. They have a bunch of these at the bonsai museum.

 

[pandacular]

I really appreciated pandaculars philosophy of "try something, and see how the plant reacts".
I always learn best when I fail first, and then get tips from others on how to improve.

This is why I love nursery stock, particularly junipers. I have two nursery junipers that have been really fun to hack on. Before Frank gets worried, I should mention it's not that one.

I've definitely learned from that technique and can't wait to grab more junipers on the cheap come fall sale time. Trying different things at different times and then observing the reaction is really rewarding. Some will recommend focusing on a particular genus when starting out, which can definitely teach you a lot, but I'd say just grab what you like... though not every species should be a bonsai.

Good luck, I'll share my thoughts on the pruning in your other thread.