New Bonsai owner needs help saving his trees!

[Cormaximus]

Hi there,

I'm very new to this and recieved a "Redwood Bonsai" kit a year ago. I've been growing them from seeds and while I had a rough start really started to see some promise about 6 weeks ago. Up until 2 weeks ago, we were also looking great (picture attached)! But since then it's really gone downhill. 2nd picture is recently and it's getting worse. Overall loss of colour, yellowing (I'm guessing stressed/dying) of plants, and no growth.

I'm new so I'm sure it's due to mistakes I'm making. I could have been overwatering as when they were very young I was to keep them very wet (per instructions with seeds). I've cut back on that but am just watching them get worse so I'm hoping I can get some advice so I can save my little guys.
This is the description of the kit I got
"Bring the essence of nature and meditative relaxation to your life with this engaging bonsai kit. It contains everything you need to cultivate a grove of miniature trees that you foster along, from seedling to bonsai forest—redwood and moss seeds, growing medium, seedling training pots, bonsai shears, river stones, detailed directions, and a steel grow box.

These tiny trees are actually ancestors of the giant California redwood. Called Dawn redwoods, they were thought to be extinct until the 1940s, when one was discovered growing in a rice field in central China. And even though its towering relative is an evergreen, the Dawn redwood is one of only two known deciduous conifers. In the fall, their leafy needles turn from green to yellow to copper, bringing the pageant of the changing seasons to your desk or kitchen window. Kit made in Idaho."

 

[leatherback]

I am afraid that you are trying to safe a weed, rather than a redwood.

 

[Cajunrider]

Umm.... this does not look like redwood at all to me.
A lot of times the bonsai kits come with seeds from weeds mixed in there. The bonsai seeds never germinate and the weeds come up, giving the grower false hope for a few weeks. This will last just long enough to exceed the refund period for the kits.
If you are interested in growing from seeds, get the seeds from reputable seed suppliers. May I suggest buying seedlings for the species you are interested in instead of starting from seeds? Growing from seeds is a difficult route for bonsai beginners.

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Welcome to the site! We have probably all tried those "grow a bonsai from seed" kits, and I'm not sure any of us have been successful, though they have been a lot of fun

A Coast Redwood seedling looks like this:



It appears what you are growing is Irish Moss (Sagina subulta). Not really a weed, per se, but a landscape groundcover that may have just happened to be in the soil mix. I don't see a Coast Redwood in there. HOWEVER if you want to jump start your voyage, you may simply decide to order a Coast Redwood seedling on Amazon. You can get one delivered for under $15 and get a two year jump.

 

[BrightsideB]

Welcome to the site! We have probably all tried those "grow a bonsai from seed" kits, and I'm not sure any of us have been successful, though they have been a lot of fun

A Coast Redwood seedling looks like this:

View attachment 499974

It appears what you are growing is Irish Moss (Sagina subulta). Not really a weed, per se, but a landscape groundcover that may have just happened to be in the soil mix. I don't see a Coast Redwood in there. HOWEVER if you want to jump start your voyage, you may simply decide to order a Coast Redwood seedling on Amazon. You can get one delivered for under $15 and get a two year jump.

Does look like Irish moss.

 

[rockm]

Irish moss can overwhelm the soil and subdue growth of anything under it. At this point, it has taken over your soil. Best is to pull it up by its roots and get rid of it. In doing that you're going to have to be watchful of pulling up the seed or seedling underneath it.

Also, it's not clear where you are. Climate (dependent on geographic location--country/state) is one of the most important pieces of info we can use to help you.

And BTW, IGNORE the advice given for Dawn redwood with your kit. It is a death sentence for the species. It CANNOT be kept indoors. It will die. The "turn from green to yellow to copper, bringing the pageant of the changing seasons to your desk or kitchen window" will more likely be the tree dying off. Dawn redwoods are fully hardy in temperate zones. They're popular species to use for bonsai since they are so tough (when kept outside). Indoor conditions have extremely low light and humidity levels which kill off temperate zone species in a couple of years (and if you're keeping this inside, might be the reason the tree never grew).

Dawn Redwood (Metasequoia Glypostrobides) Care Sheet

DAWN REDWOOD(Metasequoia Glypostrobides)PLANT CARE SHEET Tips and Tricks for Caring for Your Dawn Redwood Tree The Dawn Redwood is one of the most exciting trees in the redwood family. It was rediscovered in the 1940s and planted in the United States in 1948. Before that, it was feared to be...

www.superflybonsai.com

 

[Michael P]

What a disappointing experience for your first exploration of bonsai! But it wasn't your fault so don't be afraid to try again with better material.

 

[GGB]

Some great lessons here though!

1 - this is what Irish moss looks like, never let it grow in any of your pots, trust me. I would throw out all the soil in the trash so it doesn't sprout later when you reuse the soil.
2- it is extremely leggy and unhappy, if this were a tree it would probably look even worse. Seeds get off to a terrible start indoors, unless you have a terrific grow light set up with fans.
3 - that soil would have been far to wet for almost any tree to grow in.

I'm not knocking you at all. It's a bummer. But the really important part is that you learn from stuff like this so it doesn't get repeated. Keep trying

 

[Bonsai Nut]

My daughter bought me a "Mini Bonsai Kit" for a Christmas stocking stuffer several years ago. She intended it as a joke, but I decided to try to see if, with all my experience, I could actually grow something. I had decent success until the first winter. 5 seeds in the kit, 4 germinated, and I moved four into a tiny pot I had at which point a critter ate the top off one of the seedlings. I can't recall the species of tree, but it was a cold hardy tree and I was living in SoCal at the time. None of the seedlings made it past the next spring. So a year of fun!

 

[Cormaximus]

Wow, for randomly finding this community this morning and hoping I'd even get 1 reply I'm so grateful for all the feedback!
Sounds resoundlying like I do not have trees at all, which does make me feel a little better. Though I do now feel a little silly I've spent a year trying to nurture some Irish moss to grow

I live in South East Michigan and would love any recommendations for (sounds like seedling over seeds) a species that I could give a second shot. I am hoping to have it be indoor but could def take the tree for some outside time during the warmer months. I do have a small uv/grow light I used on my moss over the winter.

For what it's worth I've really loved watching my moss grow; I'd be so much more excited to do it with a real tree instead hahaha

Appreciate any further recommendations and again, thank you all for such a warm welcome

 

[jradics]

Sorry your !st attempt didnt turn out like you wanted. If you are close to civilization, go to Lowes or Home depot or better yet, an actual nursery, and buy a 1 gallon procumbens nana juniper (or a blue rug if thats all they have). Repot it, do a little trimming, maybe some wire and just enjoy keeping it alive. You can also look around most anywhere and find a wild seedling tree about a foot tall and bring it home to grow in a pot

 

[MaciekA]

For what it's worth, the irish moss results aren't too bad. This is a weed to some, and definitely something most of us remove from bonsai pots, however, this is also sold at the ground cover sections of garden centers. So, hey, you grew something that has market value.

Probably nothing lost to the overall bonsai timeline either, because if you resume with a coast redwood seedling like the one @Bonsai Nut posted, you'll quickly blast past the theoretical seedlings that would have sprung from the kit and taken more time to gain momentum.

 

[FreshAirSunshine]

I’d also look to see if there’s a Bonsai club near you or bonsai nursery! You can get a lot out of a single day introductory class. If it’s a club you can bring a nursery plant and maybe get some guidance on first styling! Id strongly suggest working from nursery material or at least several-year-old plants. It allows you to get into the actions of performing bonsai sooner. Growing from seed alongside that can be good - many people like that part as well - but I think having something you can trim, wire, repot, etc is good and that typically is a plant with a few years of age to it.

 

[Dogestoevsky]

BNut is a great community, welcome! Lots of bonsai enthusiasts from your area on here, do a search for Michigan and I’m sure you’ll find suggestions for species and loads of inspiration. Check out Bonsai House if you’re in the Detroit area and able to drive out to Dearborn (I think it’s in Dearborn? Been a while).

 

[jradics]

Hi there,

I'm very new to this and recieved a "Redwood Bonsai" kit a year ago. I've been growing them from seeds and while I had a rough start really started to see some promise about 6 weeks ago. Up until 2 weeks ago, we were also looking great (picture attached)! But since then it's really gone downhill. 2nd picture is recently and it's getting worse. Overall loss of colour, yellowing (I'm guessing stressed/dying) of plants, and no growth.

I'm new so I'm sure it's due to mistakes I'm making. I could have been overwatering as when they were very young I was to keep them very wet (per instructions with seeds). I've cut back on that but am just watching them get worse so I'm hoping I can get some advice so I can save my little guys.View attachment 499970View attachment 499971
This is the description of the kit I got
"Bring the essence of nature and meditative relaxation to your life with this engaging bonsai kit. It contains everything you need to cultivate a grove of miniature trees that you foster along, from seedling to bonsai forest—redwood and moss seeds, growing medium, seedling training pots, bonsai shears, river stones, detailed directions, and a steel grow box.

These tiny trees are actually ancestors of the giant California redwood. Called Dawn redwoods, they were thought to be extinct until the 1940s, when one was discovered growing in a rice field in central China. And even though its towering relative is an evergreen, the Dawn redwood is one of only two known deciduous conifers. In the fall, their leafy needles turn from green to yellow to copper, bringing the pageant of the changing seasons to your desk or kitchen window. Kit made in Idaho."

re-reading your original post...you mention you plan on keeping your plants indoors. ficus will be your best bet

 

[ShadyStump]

Wow, for randomly finding this community this morning and hoping I'd even get 1 reply I'm so grateful for all the feedback!
Sounds resoundlying like I do not have trees at all, which does make me feel a little better. Though I do now feel a little silly I've spent a year trying to nurture some Irish moss to grow

I live in South East Michigan and would love any recommendations for (sounds like seedling over seeds) a species that I could give a second shot. I am hoping to have it be indoor but could def take the tree for some outside time during the warmer months. I do have a small uv/grow light I used on my moss over the winter.

For what it's worth I've really loved watching my moss grow; I'd be so much more excited to do it with a real tree instead hahaha

Appreciate any further recommendations and again, thank you all for such a warm welcome

If you're looking for something to keep indoors, you'll want a tropical tree, and it won't be a conifer. Ficus are great for learning on, and have been kept as houseplants for a very long time. They're tough as nails, very forgiving, and adapt decently to indoor conditions (though, of course, they do better outdoors).
If your heart is set on a conifer, dawn redwood is actually a great choice. It's sort of the best of both worlds between conifers and deciduous. I really should get myself one.

 

[jradics]

If you're looking for something to keep indoors, you'll want a tropical tree, and it won't be a conifer. Ficus are great for learning on, and have been kept as houseplants for a very long time. They're tough as nails, very forgiving, and adapt decently to indoor conditions (though, of course, they do better outdoors).
If your heart is set on a conifer, dawn redwood is actually a great choice. It's sort of the best of both worlds between conifers and deciduous. I really should get myself one.

LOOKS LIKE YOU BEAT ME TO IT BY 2 MINUTES. BENT MINDS THINK ALIKE

 

[ShadyStump]

LOOKS LIKE YOU BEAT ME TO IT BY 2 MINUTES. BENT MINDS THINK ALIKE

Well you have to be a little twisted to understand your trees' points of view.

 

[MSU JBoots]

Wow, for randomly finding this community this morning and hoping I'd even get 1 reply I'm so grateful for all the feedback!
Sounds resoundlying like I do not have trees at all, which does make me feel a little better. Though I do now feel a little silly I've spent a year trying to nurture some Irish moss to grow

I live in South East Michigan and would love any recommendations for (sounds like seedling over seeds) a species that I could give a second shot. I am hoping to have it be indoor but could def take the tree for some outside time during the warmer months. I do have a small uv/grow light I used on my moss over the winter.

For what it's worth I've really loved watching my moss grow; I'd be so much more excited to do it with a real tree instead hahaha

Appreciate any further recommendations and again, thank you all for such a warm welcome

As a bonsai enthusiast who failed miserably at two bonsai starter kits and also lives in Michigan I would deter you from trying to get a tree that will grow inside. I have about 15 trees and only one do I keep inside in the winter even with a nice LED grow light. It is a ficus and it is the least enjoyable experience I have. It struggles every winter and barely regains steam in the summer. My trees that stay outdoors are much more enjoyable. I have a variety but personally like pines and junipers. I would suggest finding what you like that will survive in Michigan winters. If you want an indoor tree it can be done but it seems like more effort than it’s worth.

 

[rockm]

Wow, for randomly finding this community this morning and hoping I'd even get 1 reply I'm so grateful for all the feedback!
Sounds resoundlying like I do not have trees at all, which does make me feel a little better. Though I do now feel a little silly I've spent a year trying to nurture some Irish moss to grow

I live in South East Michigan and would love any recommendations for (sounds like seedling over seeds) a species that I could give a second shot. I am hoping to have it be indoor but could def take the tree for some outside time during the warmer months. I do have a small uv/grow light I used on my moss over the winter.

For what it's worth I've really loved watching my moss grow; I'd be so much more excited to do it with a real tree instead hahaha

Appreciate any further recommendations and again, thank you all for such a warm welcome

There are no such thing as "indoor" bonsai, only species of trees that can tolerate the rough conditions. Those species are always tropical in origin --ficus, shefflera and a few others. Temperate zone trees-conifers and deciduous hardwoods--will not survive inside.

Unfortunately, Westerners have a traditional misconception that bonsai are delicate indoor hothouse plants. Nothing can be further from the truth. The concept of indoor bonsai is of western origin. There are no indoor bonsai in Japan. Bonsai have traditionally be made from temperate zone tree species that are kept outdoors all the time. Additionally, most of the spectacular bonsai in Japan and the West nowadays are made from LARGER trees that are cut down to size, not grown up from smaller trees. Both can be done, but starting from seed is a very, very, very, VERY long journey to making a bonsai. You're doing nothing really for the first decade or even more-mostly just growing a thicker trunk that can be the foundation of a future bonsai.

Bonsaiists speed that process along by starting with already thick trunks, then severely reducing the top and regrowing a shorter apex and new branching. There are a few ways to do that, but it's the basic principle. They don't think it terms of planting seeds and waiting to use those trees exclusively.

Larger stock trees can be found at landscape nurseries and in the wild. Collecting "bonsai-able" trees from the wild is one of the most exciting expressions of bonsai, as you have to look for likely candidate trees, know how to dig them up with out killing them and then craft them into believable bonsai.

As a beginner, you should first learn how to care for a bonsai--it's not hard, but it can be confusing. If you want an indoor tree, get a ficus. They are hardy and tough and forgiving of the many MANY mistakes you have ahead (all of us climbed the steep learning curve and all of us are still climbing and learning). They should also be outside in full sun in all summer as that allows them to recover a bit from being inside and get strong enough to survive another winter indoors.

FWIW, keeping an indoor tree is a lot more complicated than an outdoor, temperate native species. A lot more can and does go wrong inside. Outside trees are more easily kept since they're in a more stable environment, have more resources, are able to handle the weather because that's how they spent millions of years evolving. Outdoor species also have more character and tend to be more interesting--maples display the same fall colors as their counterparts in the woods, pines can bear snow loads in the winter, flowering fruit trees (Apples are tough as nails in a container) blossom in the spring and bear fruit in the fall..