911 - Shore Pine browning, help please!!!

[rollwithak]

Hi All,
I fear it may be too late for this one but I figured I’d turn to the wisdom of the Nutters. This Shore Pine has slowly been showing signs of browning since mid summer. I initially thought it was just normal shedding of needles but as you can see, it’s grown considerably worse. I’m not seeing anything on the needles that would be an external fungus but I’m wondering if there is a root issue. The plant never dried out completely over summer. There was a decent wound on it from wire when I added some shape to it, so perhaps something entered the tree through the wound.

All in all, I know you guys and gals aren’t miracle workers but just figured I’d ask for some expertise and ideas!?

Thank you in advance

 

[Crazy Diamond]

Overwatering looks like

 

[rollwithak]

Overwatering looks like

So allowing to dry out may help? Or is this puppy toast?

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

It looks pretty toasty to me.
But low temps can do a number on the color too. When a pine is in bad health, especially with watering issues, foliage can turn yellow, golden brown and purple.
A hot nail can help you pierce the pot so it has some extra breathing holes. From there on forward it's easy on the watering and keeping your fingers crossed.

 

[Potawatomi13]

Very strong suspicion Summers heat/your area dryness killed it. These coastal trees live in fog zone, damp air, some amount of ocean coolness none of which you have. Sorry for loss. Perhaps Lodgepole from neighboring dry mountains "might" do better?

 

[rollwithak]

It looks pretty toasty to me.
But low temps can do a number on the color too. When a pine is in bad health, especially with watering issues, foliage can turn yellow, golden brown and purple.
A hot nail can help you pierce the pot so it has some extra breathing holes. From there on forward it's easy on the watering and keeping your fingers crossed.

Guessing a full on repot in better soil would just finish it off?

 

[rollwithak]

It looks pretty toasty to me.
But low temps can do a number on the color too. When a pine is in bad health, especially with watering issues, foliage can turn yellow, golden brown and purple.
A hot nail can help you pierce the pot so it has some extra breathing holes. From there on forward it's easy on the watering and keeping your fingers crossed.

Yeah doesn’t look to be too many live roots left there. I think this was just way too saturated and wet. Oh well. Another one bites the dust

 

[ghues]

So did you repot it after this photo? There may not be any active roots but the reddish ones look alive. As @Potawatomi13 stated above a Shore Pine may not be the Pine for your environment. Where did you get it?

 

[River's Edge]

It would be helpful if you gave some information. When was the tree acquired from the nursery? What type of soil is it one? How often have you watered it since you acquired it ? Have you repotted it at all?
It appears to be still tagged from the nursery and in nursery soil which is likely to require less watering than a normal bonsai! If it was watered regularly with no opportunity to begin to dry out between waterings than this is the result.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Yeah doesn’t look to be too many live roots left there. I think this was just way too saturated and wet. Oh well. Another one bites the dust

That doesn't look all that bad actually. I've seen worse. But it sure looks a bit mushy. If it would bounce back, it'll take a year or two of recovering.
Did you dispose this plant or did you actually do a repot? Because I would give it a chance. If you did the repot, winter protection might be a good idea.

 

[rollwithak]

It would be helpful if you gave some information. When was the tree acquired from the nursery? What type of soil is it one? How often have you watered it since you acquired it ? Have you repotted it at all?
It appears to be still tagged from the nursery and in nursery soil which is likely to require less watering than a normal bonsai! If it was watered regularly with no opportunity to begin to dry out between waterings than this is the result.

So this was actually a seedling purchase from a site/nursery from up in Northern California. It came in a “pine package” of several pine varieties. I initially just potted it in free draining potting mix with a little bit of grit gravel that I mixed i to it. It was definitely retaining more water than it should. I have since repotted in an bonsai mix that will keep it less wet and provide more air. Lesson learned!

 

[rollwithak]

That doesn't look all that bad actually. I've seen worse. But it sure looks a bit mushy. If it would bounce back, it'll take a year or two of recovering.
Did you dispose this plant or did you actually do a repot? Because I would give it a chance. If you did the repot, winter protection might be a good idea.

Yeah. I was hoping to see some healthy white ones sprinkled in there but it was too wet to actually expect that. Here’s the current state of it, crossing my fingers, not the end of the world but I’ve had it for a couple seasons and was looking forward to continuing the journey. It doesn’t get too cold here in the Central Valley in the winter, few weeks where we might hit freezing a bit but nothing crazy for the most part. I have an indoor grow room, you think that would be best? I am worried the drastic change into artificial lighting might shock this plant even more.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

I would leave it be for now. Indoors they tend do go belly up for me, and anyone except Cmeg. Props to him!

Not to piss you off or anything, that soil looks awesome.. though a bit.. dry.
Now that it's in less mucky and better aerating soil, you can probably water as much as you like.

Fricking pines man.. It's always something!

 

[River's Edge]

I have an indoor grow room, you think that would be best?

I would not put a pine indoors for growing. Indoor setups can be advantageous for propagation and juvenile seedlings, cuttings but not for this purpose! Water properly for the current mix and be patient. Your location and climatic zone should not need winter protection for pines even in a weakened state. Further disruption, repotting or fluctuation of care routines will just create further complications. The last thing it needs at this point is something else done to it. Here are my pines in a much colder zone all prepared for winter. When I say prepared for winter they are just waiting in the same place they spent the summer! This is one group of several within the nursery.

 

[rollwithak]

I would leave it be for now. Indoors they tend do go belly up for me, and anyone except Cmeg. Props to him!

Not to piss you off or anything, that soil looks awesome.. though a bit.. dry.
Now that it's in less mucky and better aerating soil, you can probably water as much as you like.

Fricking pines man.. It's always something!

It is and I watered it today. It was wet underneath as I added a dry layer on top

 

[rollwithak]

I would not put a pine indoors for growing. Indoor setups can be advantageous for propagation and juvenile seedlings, cuttings but not for this purpose! Water properly for the current mix and be patient. Your location and climatic zone should not need winter protection for pines even in a weakened state. Further disruption, repotting or fluctuation of care routines will just create further complications. The last thing it needs at this point is something else done to it. Here are my pines in a much colder zone all prepared for winter. When I say prepared for winter they are just waiting in the same place they spent the summer! This is one group of several within the nursery.

I was going to say, you growing those things commercially?

 

[River's Edge]

I was going to say, you growing those things commercially?

If you are interested you can check out my website. it is included in my signature.