Branch graft placement help

[BPJon]

Well I am asking you guys for different ideas on where should I place branches on this pine. This guy is special to me for a few reasons. One the pine was kept for 20 years by my bonsai teacher. Two in 2002 Kunio Kobayashi was in Miami,Florida and was going to different private collectors and everywhere else they were taking him. If I recall the story it was Brussel Martin and Mike Rogers both good friends of my teacher. Anyways he went to my teachers house and made a few changes to this pine one being wire for the bark to grow into and swell around it at the bottom and two the twist it has was all Kobayashi doing. Ok so back to the post can you guys photoshop the branch placement of the grafts. It's ideas I'm looking for because all these brains working together create better material. I will post the areas I think if I can do it on my phone. Thank you guys so much for your help and taking time to do this.

 

[BPJon]

I was thinking of my main left branch shortened and graft a branch on the first curve on the left and a back branch as well. What do you think? Thanks I know we have some seriously good pine people here that can help big time with this tree.

 

[A Random User]

Please don't take this the wrong way cause I am not trying to be insulting here. Just curious... as to how you seem to have some very nice material, both this tree and the one you sold, but yet lack the understanding of how to possibly work the tree as well as what their value might be? My reasoning for asking is that usually someone newer to bonsai does not have such material. And someone who is not new to bonsai, that has the material that you have, would already know the answers to the questions that you have been asking?

With that said... I would answer your thread question with the following.
I personally would not see the need to graft anything onto this tree. I think one could easily bring down the top portion of your tree, just above the bend, compressing the whole composition. Making the tree that much stronger, and compact. Then go about wiring the main branches and secondary branches accordingly. Thus framing the trunk that you have, which obviously is the feature of the tree.

It is hard to tell from the photo exactly what is going on in whirl... It appears as though you might have quite a few branches protruding from the same spot on the trunk. If this is the case then this would be an issue to deal with. I also, would want to start looking into how, and if one could remedy the two crossing roots at the base of the trunk. Seeing that for the most part this tree's trunk seems to be free of issues, would be a shame to have these ruin the image.

 

[BPJon]

Not new to bonsai at all I have been into bonsai since 2007 not many years but a good amount of time and have had a great teacher. Now the price question was because I don't sell much if any but that tree was available for a great price and I could make as much as I can so I asked if $1600 would have been to much. Yes I see what your saying about bringing down branches but that would never make a really good tree in an informal upright stand point. Bottom branches are important to make it a great tree. I know what I want to do with the tree but this is me talking to others about what they would. I am not asking really what to do? Do you understand the difference? It a way of talking with others who are into bonsai and mabey have an idea better than mine. I have been collecting black pines for a while now so that's how I have collected good material. I didn't ask how to graft I asked about adding some branching and where would you do it before I start what I have in mind. Also no there is no handle bars there I will get some structure pics up tomorrow during the day time. Anyways I hope you understand what I am doing here. If you go to a workshop you talk and others give advice and input that's is what I am doing before I do anything. I have my locals group that we work together but imagine a workshop with over 50 people who all are helping each other. Wouldn't the tree have better end results from so many eyes working together? So like I said I know what and how I want to do. I don't know everything and very far from that but please read the question as its a workshop mentality. I didn't take anythjng the wrong way. What you said was what has been being done as of now but really look at the world class informals they have to have at least what I'm aiming at a nice bottom branch with a back one then the next one can be up there. Also I look for a while before picking up a tree for myself. Also from the day i started bonsai I went bp crazy and bought a lot of pines. So I just happen to have a good amount of them. This is me in 08 with a pine in a Ben Oki workshop. I am wearing the red shirt so again understand this is making making conversation with other bonsai enthusiast. Thanks for your input on what you would do.

 

[Cmanz]

I think sawgrass nailed it with his idea to compress this tree. This would flow the best with the structure you have. Coiled trunk pines often use only a few branches pulled down from just bellow the crown to build their silhouette, since they are never seen out of leaf anyways. No graft needed. Additionally I would just cut off the crossing root closest to the trunk and bend the remaining part of the root further out if needed.

 

[BPJon]

Thanks guys for the inputs I know grafting on it is a stupid idea but it was just thinking a little different. The tree will continue the way it's going with branches going down the way it should be. lol my teacher was like I will cut your fingers off if you do this to the tree.lol he would too. I will be posting some other grafting projects on an old pine with no inner branching due to poor maintenance. The branching is way to old to break new buds so I will post pics of before and after the grafts. Thanks

 

[Eric Group]

I too like the idea of squashing that top down a bit, adding some bend to that curve right off the thick part of the trunk. That was the first thing hat came to my mind when I looked at it. I don't see a good place to graft low branch on this tree from the angle you are showing us.

When tilting it, you could easily wire that branch coming down off the left to be an interesting first branch- nothing wrong with bringing the top of the tree down to serve as the lower branch.