Complete Outdoor Set-up

[DrTolhur]

What all is needed for a 24/7/365 outdoor bonsai set-up? I live in the middle of a city in lower Michigan. I don't think there are any deer, but plenty of squirrels, rabbits, and chipmunks. Plenty of cold (-15 to 35 F) and snow in winter. I'm hoping for a set-it-and-forget-it kind of set-up. (Not the plants, just the set-up.) Does that exist? Is there any way to permanently protect the plants from critters while still open to air, sunlight, and water?

I'm also wondering about the effects of wind and rain. Do bonsai trees need any protection for heavy downpours or wind? It seems like they could be damaged or knocked over, or rain could cause loss of soil.

Corollary: since many bonsai are sensitive to over-watering, do you need to cover them in periods of prolonged rainfall?

I know everyone says almost all (actually all?) bonsai trees fare far better outside, but it seems like there's a lot to contend with when keeping such a particular thing outside where so much is out of your control.

 

[just.wing.it]

Critters will always be a problem.....grow lots of trees! They won't kill them all....usually.

Could grow your tree inside of a pet crate, but that only keeps the big ones out.
Maybe a really nice ventilated greenhouse....

 

[Shibui]

Rain is not usually a problem. Even a couple of weeks of rain is not the problem. Any problems were there from poor culture before the rain. Choosing a suitable potting soil goes a long way to preventing drainage problems. Rain can wash soil out of the pots. Gravel mulch or moss is usually used to slow that erosion down or just keep topping it up when it falls too low. How much disappears also depend whether you mound the soil up above the pot or not and also on the soil components.

Critters will always be a problem. Those that climb or fly are even more of a problem. Enclosing the trees appropriately is always the safest option but also raises other problems - snow will build up on overheard mesh and crush most structures.

What you end up with will be influenced by the funds you are willing to put up. With unlimited funds you can design and build a bonsai Fort Knox that will withstand determined critters, hurricane and dumps of snow but few have that sort of wherewithall. Cost will also depend on the trees you want to keep - numbers and species - some do not need the same level of protection and may be Ok without any cover.
Wind is an issue for many. Trees can be tied down to the stands in windy areas` or wind breaks to reduce wind strength in the area.

Not sure that set and forget is really a good aspiration. For good results bonsai need to be managed regularly. They need to be turned regularly to ensure even sun on all sides so shaded sides don't get weak. Trimming , fertilizing, pest management all a lot of require hands on.

 

[amcoffeegirl]

I have seen a dual kind of greenhouse set up where it’s tropical on one side and hardy trees on the other. They both would need to be climate controlled at different temps.

 

[Carol 83]

What all is needed for a 24/7/365 outdoor bonsai set-up? I live in the middle of a city in lower Michigan. I don't think there are any deer, but plenty of squirrels, rabbits, and chipmunks. Plenty of cold (-15 to 35 F) and snow in winter. I'm hoping for a set-it-and-forget-it kind of set-up. (Not the plants, just the set-up.) Does that exist? Is there any way to permanently protect the plants from critters while still open to air, sunlight, and water?

I'm also wondering about the effects of wind and rain. Do bonsai trees need any protection for heavy downpours or wind? It seems like they could be damaged or knocked over, or rain could cause loss of soil.

Corollary: since many bonsai are sensitive to over-watering, do you need to cover them in periods of prolonged rainfall?

I know everyone says almost all (actually all?) bonsai trees fare far better outside, but it seems like there's a lot to contend with when keeping such a particular thing outside where so much is out of your control.

Move to Florida

 

[rockm]

Shelves, benches, fences...They are your friends. Get the trees UP off the ground. The further from the ground, the less opportunity for a lot of stuff, from insects to rabbits, will have access. Squirrels are a plague. You can discourage them with the usual "scarecrow" devices--pie tins on string, sprinklers, (air rifles, shotguns if you're desperate and have the room), etc. Sad to say, squirrels are a fact of life. They can mess with trees--the larger the bonsai, the less damage they can do. And for the most part, they're really just a nuisance, not a death sentence. If you have the trees in decent bonsai soil, rain isn't a factor. If you're losing soil because of rain runoff, you're not repotting properly, soil shouldn't be mounded above the pot rim for the most part. Wind and air circulation are necessary for healthy trees (if your trees are small, anchor them to their benches with wire if you're concerned about strong wind.

I live 10 feet from the woods. All my trees are outside, have been for a couple of decades now. They're all up on Shelves and monkey pole platforms. I also have stored them all in the backyard on the ground under mulch in the winter. Leaving trees exposed to winter temperatures on benches or without root protection will kill them...

Bottom line, no, there is no "set and forget" 24/7/365 way to keep trees outside. They require attention when outside--not constant, but daily maintenance chores and seasonal chores such as relocating them for winter storage, turning occasionally for even sun exposure, etc. You manage the risk-it's a necessary risk, as the alternative inside will kill them.

 

[sorce]

There are a couple other threads like this with great ideas.

MY GARDEN, SHARE YOURS

Three and a half years ago I started my bonsai garden. Before that time, I had long benches simply set on the grass. Ultimately I wanted to create a garden specifically designed to display my bonsai. Having been in Japan twice now, I took home many design and aesthetic tips. I did not set out to...

www.bonsainut.com

That's one of the better ones.

Sorce

 

[DrTolhur]

Thanks for the input. Sounds like outdoors is just going to require substantially more peripheral care than indoors no matter what. That's why I went with a Fukien tea as my first tree after seeing that it's rated highly for indoor use and I'm not currently prepared for outdoor maintenance.

Shibui, regarding your last comment, that's what I was hoping to get at by saying that the set-up is set and forget, not the plants. I fully plan to regularly attend to my plants, but I'm less interested in tending to pest prevention and other such chores that I'd consider peripheral to the actual bonsai itself. So I might stick to indoor plants for things I care about and only keep things outside that have less time and money invested so I'm not as bothered if they get messed up.

(I know that bonsai is ideally outside, and there are arguably no indoor bonsai species, but I'm just starting out, and it sounds like outdoor care requires more investment in time and money than I'm interested in putting in right now. I'm not trying to be stubborn or disrespect the art, just trying to gather and process information and apply it to my situation. I've read a bunch here and elsewhere, and I understand what I'm doing and am willing to accept lesser results due to my approach, recognizing that such lesser results might well be because of my approach. Again, I do thank y'all for your information. It was what I'm looking for and helpful for me now and going forward.)

 

[Colorado]

You’re overthinking this. It is not all that complicated to keep a few trees outside.

You’re also in for a surprise if you think indoor trees are immune to pests and disease.

 

[rockm]

Thanks for the input. Sounds like outdoors is just going to require substantially more peripheral care than indoors no matter what. That's why I went with a Fukien tea as my first tree after seeing that it's rated highly for indoor use and I'm not currently prepared for outdoor maintenance.

Shibui, regarding your last comment, that's what I was hoping to get at by saying that the set-up is set and forget, not the plants. I fully plan to regularly attend to my plants, but I'm less interested in tending to pest prevention and other such chores that I'd consider peripheral to the actual bonsai itself. So I might stick to indoor plants for things I care about and only keep things outside that have less time and money invested so I'm not as bothered if they get messed up.

(I know that bonsai is ideally outside, and there are arguably no indoor bonsai species, but I'm just starting out, and it sounds like outdoor care requires more investment in time and money than I'm interested in putting in right now. I'm not trying to be stubborn or disrespect the art, just trying to gather and process information and apply it to my situation. I've read a bunch here and elsewhere, and I understand what I'm doing and am willing to accept lesser results due to my approach, recognizing that such lesser results might well be because of my approach. Again, I do thank y'all for your information. It was what I'm looking for and helpful for me now and going forward.)

No, keeping trees outdoors is SUBSTANTIALLY LESS COMPLICATED AND TIME CONSUMING than keeping them indoors SUCCESSFULLY.

Indoor trees are subject to extremely harsh environmental conditions--desert-level humidity levels and extremely low light are two of the worst. The constant "overcare" by concerned owners is another, since the plants are in closer proximity to inflict damage. Kids, cats, smokers, clutsy inlaws are all also issues indoors...

Outdoor trees' conditions are met mostly automatically by being outside in the sun wind and rain, just like have lived for literally a few billion years. (ALL trees are outdoor trees, only some can be kept inside because they're tough enough to tolerate it).

Like it or not, if you have the bonsai itch, you have to realize it is not a "standoff" hobby. It requires work, not a lot of it all at once, but small chores done repeatedly over time. If you're not up to that, you're never going to successfully keep them.

"Lesser results" in the case of indoor trees are dead trees. That is the path you have when you begin in bonsai is a defacto "houseplant" they're not. Unless you're willing to invest in high-light and humidification systems or a greenhouse, your indoor path leads to mostly a dead end. Also, the quality of "indoor' bonsai trees sold at most commercial non-bonsai specialist shops are plain crummy and are pretty ugly...

 

[rockm]

No, keeping trees outdoors is SUBSTANTIALLY LESS COMPLICATED AND TIME CONSUMING than keeping them indoors SUCCESSFULLY.

Indoor trees are subject to extremely harsh environmental conditions--desert-level humidity levels and extremely low light are two of the worst. The constant "overcare" by concerned owners is another, since the plants are in closer proximity to inflict damage. Kids, cats, smokers, clutsy inlaws are all also issues indoors...

Outdoor trees' conditions are met mostly automatically by being outside in the sun wind and rain, just like have lived for literally a few billion years. (ALL trees are outdoor trees, only some can be kept inside because they're tough enough to tolerate it).

Like it or not, if you have the bonsai itch, you have to realize it is not a "standoff" hobby. It requires work, not a lot of it all at once, but small chores done repeatedly over time. If you're not up to that, you're never going to successfully keep them.

"Lesser results" in the case of indoor trees are dead trees. That is the path you have when you begin in bonsai is a defacto "houseplant" they're not. Unless you're willing to invest in high-light and humidification systems or a greenhouse, your indoor path leads to mostly a dead end. Also, the quality of "indoor' bonsai trees sold at most commercial non-bonsai specialist shops are plain crummy and are pretty ugly...

And also, I understand you're asking about the physical infrastructure outside and its maintenance. It's not all that big of a deal. Stacks of cinder blocks can function as bench supports, later rearranged in the fall as a pit to hold mulched overwintering trees.) I have two heavy days of labor a year to change things around from "growing" to "overwintering" set up. You're going to spend more money on repeatedly replacing worn out trees indoors than I have invested in (mostly) single purchase cinder blocks and mulch

 

[JudyB]

Here is what I do, although it's far from being set and forget. I am away (in normal years) from my collection for days at a time though, and this has kept my collection from damage and healthy, during the summer. I have a overwintering house for winter, but that's another story. I use electric sheep fence, it's a soft woven short green fence that goes around my bonsai areas. It turns on at 10pm and off at 6am. Usually there is little to worry about during the day from critters, at night is when the raccoons/squirrels can cause real damage. I have benches in several different places, one is more sunny for trees that like that, one for shade lovers, and a structure that is able to be closed via sliding screens and side shade panels like roman shades, for plants that don't like wind, or in stormy conditions, most of the trees get moved into there for safety. I have a purpose built automatic watering system that has easily programmable timers so it can be adjusted for different tree areas or weather conditions (mainly temps). I think that being on a hill in a windy area and having some smaller trees, I have more to worry about from wind than people with large trees, or mostly pines, as they are more impervious to wind than deciduous trees. If any of this sounds interesting to anyone I can post some photos or provide more information.

 

[Colorado]

Here is what I do, although it's far from being set and forget. I am away (in normal years) from my collection for days at a time though, and this has kept my collection from damage and healthy, during the summer. I have a overwintering house for winter, but that's another story. I use electric sheep fence, it's a soft woven short green fence that goes around my bonsai areas. It turns on at 10pm and off at 6am. Usually there is little to worry about during the day from critters, at night is when the raccoons/squirrels can cause real damage. I have benches in several different places, one is more sunny for trees that like that, one for shade lovers, and a structure that is able to be closed via sliding screens and side shade panels like roman shades, for plants that don't like wind, or in stormy conditions, most of the trees get moved into there for safety. I have a purpose built automatic watering system that has easily programmable timers so it can be adjusted for different tree areas or weather conditions (mainly temps). I think that being on a hill in a windy area and having some smaller trees, I have more to worry about from wind than people with large trees, or mostly pines, as they are more impervious to wind than deciduous trees. If any of this sounds interesting to anyone I can post some photos or provide more information.

What type of timer do you use, Judy?

 

[JudyB]

What type of timer do you use, Judy?

I use Claber timers. I have the duo timers, so I can use the A side for one area and the B side for another. I also have separate ones for doing short burst misting in the extreme heat times. So I actually have 4 Duo's all feeding from one manifold that we built.

 

[Colorado]

I use Claber timers. I have the duo timers, so I can use the A side for one area and the B side for another. I also have separate ones for doing short burst misting in the extreme heat times. So I actually have 4 Duo's all feeding from one manifold that we built.

Thanks! I’ll check those out. We just moved to a new-to-us house so I’ll be building a new irrigation system from scratch.