Is this pot too big for the tree?

[badatusernames]

This conversation is great!

It's funny, I had been completely sold on the idea of an oval for months, but then this pot came along and rectangles started being more appealing to me... I very much appreciate the detail you all provide!

Here's a rough virt. The long straight section on the left trunk/branch adds little to the composition. Get rid of it (and develop a subapex using the existing branching), tilt it to the left, and plant the whole thing to the right of the pot. Apologies for not taking more time on the virt.

I don't think I'm going to chop the left trunk for now since once it's gone it's gone, but I see what this would accomplish and I like it. There is a real chance I will take this direction with it once I stare it it longer. Once it developed out more, I think it would create a better end result based on an initial consideration.

Interesting comment, allows the tree to speak for itself. Goes along with the pot's primary role to complement the tree.
When I consider the chosen pot above, this is what I see.
angular with soft corners, soft colour, shallow rectangle, basically straight lines.
One of the best authors for discussion of container selection is David DeGroot. My favourite section is found in his most recent book Principles of Bonsai Design.
A couple of passages for consideration.
Match the character of the tree with the character of the container.
Remember masculine and feminine characteristics are not mutually exclusive.
The tree above has slender trunks and more graceful or elegant appearance. two trunks similar in size from the same base.
A masculine tree with an elegant form is recommended to have a pot with a slim profile, restrained decoration, primarily straight lines.
A feminine tree with a graceful form is recommended to have a regular form with smooth textured surface and glazes.

The character of the tree above is both feminine and masculine. movement is more angular than rounded, bark is rougher than smooth, overall form is slender rather than strong footage or powerful base.

The softer and smoother rectangle is a good fit in this particular circumstance in my view for all of the above.
For those interested in container selection, two of the best written discussions I have encountered are within Techniques 11 by John Naka and Principle of Bonsai Design by David DeGroot. either edition of the latest book. published 2022 second edition, available through Stone Lantern.

Sounds like i need to pull out my copy of DeGroot again! This is great.

Again, I appreciate the responses and am glad for the lively conversation!

 

[Wood]

There is a real chance I will take this direction with it once I stare it it longer. Once it developed out more, I think it would create a better end result based on an initial consideration.

I don't think you're wrong that the end of the secondary branch isn't great, but the current silhouette of it isn't bad. Rebuilding one with more taper and movement at the same silhouette would be

 

[River's Edge]

I don't think you're wrong that the end of the secondary branch isn't great, but the current silhouette of it isn't bad. Rebuilding one with more taper and movement at the same silhouette would be

I immediately agree with this sentiment and then I consider what will the image be as it ages and. that smoother portion barks upland thickens proportionately as it is below.that point.
The overall visual will be rougher and more character intense as opposed to slender, elegant and exact.
I am ok with leaving it at this point.
Suspect that smooth straight section will look shorter with the bark and thickness, not so obvious as at this point.

 

[Cadillactaste]

I immediately agree with this sentiment and then I consider what will the image be as it ages and. that smoother portion barks upland thickens proportionately as it is below.that point.
The overall visual will be rougher and more character intense as opposed to slender, elegant and exact.
I am ok with leaving it at this point.
Suspect that smooth straight section will look shorter with the bark and thickness, not so obvious as at this point.

Absolutely agree. What a set back to grow and wait for the bark to age. Major set back... it's a classic yamadori. You take them and appreciate the character quirks. I honestly don't have a problem with it, as your reasoning of the bark itself will age sooner is point on. But to me it seems natural...and suits the overall structure.

I think to many wish to create a perfect tree. But...there is absolutely no such thing. Embrace the character...and grow old with it. Evolve with the tree if you can. To do otherwise...sometimes I wish people would pass on trees. To many want to butcher to make perfect. Then the tree is meh/stagnant...or truly contrived by ones inexperienced hands.

I personally...like the material with the tilt suggested. I would sell it before butchering it. But I'm kind of into yamadori right now. You take their quirks...and keep the character.

 

[badatusernames]

Definitely a lot to think on and agree there's no rush to make a decision. I definitely have looked at that section before wondering what to do with it - we will see! If I cut it, the tree should probably go in a box anyways, so for now I'll enjoy it and ponder once it's repotted.

 

[snowman04]

Interesting comment, allows the tree to speak for itself. Goes along with the pot's primary role to complement the tree.
When I consider the chosen pot above, this is what I see.
angular with soft corners, soft colour, shallow rectangle, basically straight lines.
One of the best authors for discussion of container selection is David DeGroot. My favourite section is found in his most recent book Principles of Bonsai Design.
A couple of passages for consideration.
Match the character of the tree with the character of the container.
Remember masculine and feminine characteristics are not mutually exclusive.
The tree above has slender trunks and more graceful or elegant appearance. two trunks similar in size from the same base.
A masculine tree with an elegant form is recommended to have a pot with a slim profile, restrained decoration, primarily straight lines.
A feminine tree with a graceful form is recommended to have a regular form with smooth textured surface and glazes.

The character of the tree above is both feminine and masculine. movement is more angular than rounded, bark is rougher than smooth, overall form is slender rather than strong footage or powerful base.

The softer and smoother rectangle is a good fit in this particular circumstance in my view for all of the above.
For those interested in container selection, two of the best written discussions I have encountered are within Techniques 11 by John Naka and Principle of Bonsai Design by David DeGroot. either edition of the latest book. published 2022 second edition, available through Stone Lantern.

Spot on, Frank. Reading his book now and looking at this very topic! There seems to be a lot of science to it but in the end, how does the creator feel about the end result?

 

[snowman04]

Absolutely agree. What a set back to grow and wait for the bark to age. Major set back... it's a classic yamadori. You take them and appreciate the character quirks. I honestly don't have a problem with it, as your reasoning of the bark itself will age sooner is point on. But to me it seems natural...and suits the overall structure.

I think to many wish to create a perfect tree. But...there is absolutely no such thing. Embrace the character...and grow old with it. Evolve with the tree if you can. To do otherwise...sometimes I wish people would pass on trees. To many want to butcher to make perfect. Then the tree is meh/stagnant...or truly contrived by ones inexperienced hands.

I personally...like the material with the tilt suggested. I would sell it before butchering it. But I'm kind of into yamadori right now. You take their quirks...and keep the character.

I think everyone has their version of the perfect tree! This one comes to mind...


As do many others. That's what I am enjoying most about this journey...

 

[Cadillactaste]

I think everyone has their version of the perfect tree! This one comes to mind...
View attachment 532218

As do many others. That's what I am enjoying most about this journey...

You're to sweet...this past fall. A bit more details going into the silhouette of a dramatic flame. Subtle...but getting there.

 

[snowman04]

This tree has inspired me to start one similar a year ago. It should be ready sometime next spring from my growing lab.

 

[River's Edge]

Spot on, Frank. Reading his book now and looking at this very topic! There seems to be a lot of science to it but in the end, how does the creator feel about the end result?

What intrigues me is the " nuances in application" that can be used by the artist to create interest and depth to the display. Trigger emotion and storytelling. I had some great experiences with David at Kokufu recently when he took the time to walk with me and share observations on the displays. Just having the opportunity to share the insights of professional judges really helps one understand the theory and the practise. Very fortunate to have travelled on the trip conducted by Bill Valavanis, Kora Dalager and shared the experience with other very knowledgeable Bonsai enthusiasts. Highly recommend taking part in judging critiques by professional judges when attending Bonsai shows.

 

[Cadillactaste]

This tree has inspired me to start one similar a year ago. It should be ready sometime next spring from my growing lab.

Excellent!

 

[sanchez]

I don't think this pot is ideal for the tree, particularly considering its color doesn't harmonize with nature. Imagine how the tree will look with leaves; the pot's color doesn't complement it well.

 

[badatusernames]

Well this ended up having fantastic roots which had fully filled the pot in just a year. So I worked them again - I will need to get a picture of it in its new pot, it looks great.

I'm pretty sure the root work means I shouldn't pluck the center leaves as the leaves come out this year - looking forward to being able to do that to shorten internodes. I'm curious as to how to control the apex, as I believe you really aren't supposed to perform that technique on the apex of arakawas. Please correct me if I am wrong!

 

[badatusernames]

I keep meaning to get a decent photo, but I’m out here now with my phone…

I think this is moving in the right direction. I’m thinking I leave the left trunk alone…

I think once it’s wired at this new position it’ll be looking pretty decent for where it’s at!

 

[snowman04]

It's a nice tree! You have lots of options...