Japanese maple cuttings in winter ? thoughts

[tigerscott79]

New to all this but not gardening in general however here is what i saw and thus wanted opnions or thoughts on it. Saw the other day when reading elsewhere someone posted taking Japanese maple a "cultivar" not a plain species Japanese maple cuttings in winter and they mentioned bringing inside under heat/germination mats and they claimed to be able root some as they budded out early and continued to grow them on for spring us later. I tried to go back so i could link it but cant find it and so figured i would ask here thoughts on the validity of this and if worth trying or easier to try spring /summer time . have read a bit on spring/summer ones leaves /shoots harden up a bit and others where new growth hardened but not to semi hardwood state so tbh and fair lost as heck . any advice or info that worked is welcomed . Other then germination /heat mat and or solo cup domes for humidity or zip lock baggy i wouldnt have access to any fancy misters or chemicals other then clonex rooting gel or over counter powdered rooting hormone from store locally . just thought if winter rooting is possible might be fun project to keep busy or if not how would do so come spring or summer and when and how to tell what material (maple) when stems are ready and not too early or late . i have and am still googling as much as can and reading posts here but figured some advice if anyones willing to share thanks

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

I found winter cuttings to be problematic.
So I would do spring or summer cuttings, and clonex is fine. Just stick them in the dirt and put them in a shaded spot.

At some points, especially when new to the plant hobby.. All plant hobbies for that matter.. it's sometimes good to stop googling and just give it a go. This is how we learn, how we fall and get back up again with more knowledge and skills than before.
Leatherback can root juniper cuttings like crazy, for me they hardly ever root.
I can root anything else, where others have constant issues. Even though we apply the same techniques and work in the same way.

Clonex will work for you. You don't need fancy equipment, you need a 50W LED floodlight (cool white) and some soil, it's how I've grown hundreds of seedlings.
If they root, they root and now you'll have to deal with wilting and the fact that they don't like indoor conditions at all.. If they don't root, you can try again in spring, and again in summer. That'll keep you busy ;-)

Grab a couple procumbens junipers from some store for 15 bucks and you'll have plenty to wire if you want to stay busy.

 

[tigerscott79]

I found winter cuttings to be problematic.
So I would do spring or summer cuttings, and clonex is fine. Just stick them in the dirt and put them in a shaded spot.

At some points, especially when new to the plant hobby.. All plant hobbies for that matter.. it's sometimes good to stop googling and just give it a go. This is how we learn, how we fall and get back up again with more knowledge and skills than before.
Leatherback can root juniper cuttings like crazy, for me they hardly ever root.
I can root anything else, where others have constant issues. Even though we apply the same techniques and work in the same way.

Clonex will work for you. You don't need fancy equipment, you need a 50W LED floodlight (cool white) and some soil, it's how I've grown hundreds of seedlings.
If they root, they root and now you'll have to deal with wilting and the fact that they don't like indoor conditions at all.. If they don't root, you can try again in spring, and again in summer. That'll keep you busy ;-)

Grab a couple procumbens junipers from some store for 15 bucks and you'll have plenty to wire if you want to stay busy.

Ty great advice. I did look into one the cloner mister domed neoprene collar things mainly because humidity and people have said they made propagation alot smoother. But yea I tend to wing things often but felt given the lack of material to propagate wanted ask opinions and go/grow from there . Hopefully I'm not sounding bad just being honest . I am glad to know isnt worth effort in winter and that'll save time and frustration and leave better material once grown out more and guessing hardened up a bit. Ive watched vids and seen Japanese maples more easily rooted via early spring or after 1st hardening off in early summer late spring?

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

I'm not a maple fan at all, so don't trust my words on them when it comes to the best time of taking cuttings.
I did a whole bunch of winter cuttings and they all failed, didn't even leaf out. In floaters, in sphagnum moss and in soil, in a controlled environment. That's why I think it's not the greatest idea to do winter cuttings of maples.

Even though I'm not a maple fan, we can do an exercise together if you want! And we can figure out what the best time would be.
To produce roots on cuttings, plants need a couple things:
1. First and foremost, the need for water. No need for water? Or plenty of water around? Then they don't NEED roots, because the wound can just suck them up.
2. Auxins and cytokinins, to aid in healing and new root formation.
3. Stored energy to have the energy to build roots. And/Or nutrients so that it has the building blocks to build.
4. Sugars and carbohydrates are known to inhibit rooting; if the plant can get plenty of those AND plenty of water, it doesn't need roots.

In spring when the plants are leafing out, they spend a lot of energy. Which means they also contain a lot of energy. These levels drop until the middle of summer when plants go more or less a bit dormant and try to recuperate and recover the energy they spent (in the form of carbohydrates).
Cytokinins and auxins are continually made during any active growing season, and more or less just before spring starts, but auxins are at their peak during an extending phase of the growth.

With just those two alineas of information, when would you think is the best time to take cuttings?

 

[tigerscott79]

I'm not a maple fan at all, so don't trust my words on them when it comes to the best time of taking cuttings.
I did a whole bunch of winter cuttings and they all failed, didn't even leaf out. In floaters, in sphagnum moss and in soil, in a controlled environment. That's why I think it's not the greatest idea to do winter cuttings of maples.

Even though I'm not a maple fan, we can do an exercise together if you want! And we can figure out what the best time would be.
To produce roots on cuttings, plants need a couple things:
1. First and foremost, the need for water. No need for water? Or plenty of water around? Then they don't NEED roots, because the wound can just suck them up.
2. Auxins and cytokinins, to aid in healing and new root formation.
3. Stored energy to have the energy to build roots. And/Or nutrients so that it has the building blocks to build.
4. Sugars and carbohydrates are known to inhibit rooting; if the plant can get plenty of those AND plenty of water, it doesn't need roots.

In spring when the plants are leafing out, they spend a lot of energy. Which means they also contain a lot of energy. These levels drop until the middle of summer when plants go more or less a bit dormant and try to recuperate and recover the energy they spent (in the form of carbohydrates).
Cytokinins and auxins are continually made during any active growing season, and more or less just before spring starts, but auxins are at their peak during an extending phase of the growth.

With just those two alineas of information, when would you think is the best time to take cuttings?

After or during leaf out and once the stalled late spring early summer growth restarts anew? Yea ive decided from others comments that Japanese maples shouldn't really be winter cuttings where as some evergreens can be. Since main goal is to most effectively grow and gain more bonsai material to work with I will wait til spring summer and try rooting ans airlayering. Just hard for me since I can watch 100videos but I learn more personally and retain more from doing and seeing (in respect especially to air layering) because seeing videos with them saying give 1 1/2 to 2 inch ring removed bark down to cambium layer but not into the wood is hard to ascertain for myself as I've never done but once successfully and then didn't realize to reduce leaves to prevent are roots from failing to support the new roots and plant taken from mother plant then tried same method last year and it failed fairly quickly . I believe I either cut to deeply when airlayerimg or something happened and remained to moist or dry because above the airlayering the stem died quiet fast like . So alot things trying learn and maybe got ahead myself with desire to train while winger blues and boredom yo learn and then have material come spring . Ik patience is key just sometimes angst and excitement trumps common sense of the reality to wait then begin.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Early summer growth seems to be the best time to me, which is a simple and good conclusion based on the things I've given you.
I recommended getting a couple junipers, procumbens mainly, because they can be styled at any given time without much loss. That should keep your itchy fingers busy for a while.

Patience? F- that! You just need more trees my friend. Use that excitement in your favor! I'm the type of person that has bursts of motivation and if I don't use that, the hobby dies down.
Essentially every big box store or garden center has junipers. Which should all be on sale around this time of year. They can teach you a lot about plants in the mean time, while you wait for spring to come.
You can wire those, style, prune, whatever. Give them a little protection from the frost and they'll be fine.
They're also a lot less brittle compared to maples.

 

[Scrogdor]

I've been pretty successful with winter cuttings. It's much warmer where I live though. In fact, I do all my cuttings in winter with an 80% survival rate. Generally just cut a bunch and stick them in regular garden soil.

 

[tigerscott79]

I've been pretty successful with winter cuttings. It's much warmer where I live though. In fact, I do all my cuttings in winter with an 80% survival rate. Generally just cut a bunch and stick them in regular garden soil.

Yea here the maples are asleep and dormant so didn't know of it could even work to take dormant cuttings and as they are inside would bud up and possibly root or to wait til spring buds or 2nd flush in summer to take cuttings or to airlayer ect. It's 35°f here.

 

[Kanorin]

Yea here the maples are asleep and dormant so didn't know of it could even work to take dormant cuttings and as they are inside would bud up and possibly root or to wait til spring buds or 2nd flush in summer to take cuttings or to airlayer ect. It's 35°f here.

We live in a pretty similar climate - maple cuttings do really well taken the first half of May for me (which is after the first flush of growth has hardened off). You are a little more north, so maybe a week later for you. Cuttings taken at other times can work, but that seems to be the peak of success in my experience. Two years ago I had some success with early February hardwood cuttings, but they all failed on me last year, so I've not figured out the timing and conditions on that quite yet.

 

[tigerscott79]

We live in a pretty similar climate - maple cuttings do really well taken the first half of May for me (which is after the first flush of growth has hardened off). You are a little more north, so maybe a week later for you. Cuttings taken at other times can work, but that seems to be the peak of success in my experience. Two years ago I had some success with early February hardwood cuttings, but they all failed on me last year, so I've not figured out the timing and conditions on that quite yet.

https://www.viagrow.com/products/vi...72523&pr_ref_pid=6601379381291&pr_seq=uniform. This is what I got for holiday this year so hoping or wondering if taking cuttings with zelkova serrata, Japanese maples and such might work in it or if should stick to cuttings in substrate and typical way. It's why I'm antsy on it . But ifc wanting to do when it's rifht so it succeeds versus doing it now if will fail since amou t material I have to take cuttings is extremely limited . Yea im northern Indiana (Elkhart Indiana). Really love plants so it's good mix with this hobby. Thanks for sharing when you take them and hoping can do same with some success. If I can get least 1 or 2 to root id be thrilled though more the better .

 

[JackHammer]

My best successes have been very late winter, just before leaf. The trick is keeping the humidity high. I do have some indoors, under lights with a cloche right now. They look promising but it is still early. I will start some additional cuttings when the buds are just ready to pop. I use clonex.

 

[Kanorin]

https://www.viagrow.com/products/vi...72523&pr_ref_pid=6601379381291&pr_seq=uniform. This is what I got for holiday this year so hoping or wondering if taking cuttings with zelkova serrata, Japanese maples and such might work in it or if should stick to cuttings in substrate and typical way. It's why I'm antsy on it . But ifc wanting to do when it's rifht so it succeeds versus doing it now if will fail since amou t material I have to take cuttings is extremely limited . Yea im northern Indiana (Elkhart Indiana). Really love plants so it's good mix with this hobby. Thanks for sharing when you take them and hoping can do same with some success. If I can get least 1 or 2 to root id be thrilled though more the better .

Test it out with some abundant material…maybe your neighbor has a maple they don’t mind you taking some cuttings from or something. Try things out and see what works for you!

 

[tigerscott79]

My best successes have been very late winter, just before leaf. The trick is keeping the humidity high. I do have some indoors, under lights with a cloche right now. They look promising but it is still early. I will start some additional cuttings when the buds are just ready to pop. I use clonex.

That's awesome news. I'm tempted to try the viagrow cloner and see how it does it some cuttings then.

 

[tigerscott79]

That's awesome news. I'm tempted to try the viagrow cloner and see how it does it some cuttings then.

Yea thats the main issue is cutting materials. Tbh thought about seeing if anyone had any plants they needed cut back but locally no luck im disabled and can't drive and retired so don't help there but maybe if does work can see if anyone when trimming back there trees might sell some cuttings (if they'd make it shipped ) down road to experiment with . Idk . Always down for seeing if things work .