potentials for collection?

[Nwaite]

I'll be going out as much as possible in the next week or 2 to collect trees.

Thought I would post picks to see what you all thought.
An hopefully give helpful hints and tips. Thanks.


#1 is a maple with a good 2" trunk and about 1 1\2' tall . Didn't dig around the roots to much. It's still freezing at night so I didn't want to mess with them.

#2 I'm not sure what type it is.
I'm not very good with young trees yet sorry. But it's under 2' and already has some cragly bark started on it. Was thinking of just cutting that hole chunk of the dead stump off and letting it grow on it in a pot...?

#3 I believe is a bass? It was just growing off of another trees root under ground. Thought maybe I can make something out of it.

 

[Jarath]

#2 looks like a spruce

 

[sorce]

I dig the plan for 2.
Thays a nice little landscape.
Just make sure the roots ain't to far away.

Wicked.

3 could be dope.

1 would have to have a great Spread

Sorce

 

[M. Frary]

Number 3 would be a bitch to collect. You would need to get the hunk of root from the big tree because that is its main source of water and nutrition. You basically would have a tree on a log.
Number 2 looks doable. It looks to be a spruce or fir maybe.
If you try make sure to get as many roots as possible with native soil around them.
Number 1. If it's a maple I can't help. I don't mess with any. Too large of leaves,petioles and internodes. But it looks collectable if you are set on it.
The thing about all of these trees (and I've done this in the past) is they are just run of the mill trees growing in the woods. I've collected trees since I've gotten back into bonsai that are just plain trees. Straight trunks ,hardly any taper. Just to have trees to work on. Now I hate them.
Since almost everything is now just kindling I'm looking to replace with better,more interesting trunks. Which means,and no poke at you or the trees you've chosen,is I walk by hundreds of trees that I used to collect to find the real good ones. Those aren't usually found in the woods itself but on the outskirts. Trees in the forest are all trying to get to the sunlight. So they grow tall,straight and with no taper to the trunk.
Collecting trees is a great way for people to get out. See things. Get some fresh air and exercise. And the best way to end a day of collecting is to come back with a tree or two that you lose sleep over thinking about what it can be and how to get it there.

 

[rockm]

All of those might be good for practice in collecting. Further down the road as bonsai, though, there's really not enough going on visually with any of them. It will take significant work to make anything out of them.

BTW, that last one looks to be a root sucker. It is not growing on its own roots, you will have to take some time (possibly a year or so) to sever the large parent root from the larger parent tree--which you will have to locate. Even then, it's a mess and will take some time to sort out trunks, grow a new root base, etc.

You can find better that won't require all that...

 

[sorce]

Now I hate them.

I'm with that.
------
You're still kinda learning, but as long as you sift that 8822 and water, no reason you can't keep some nice stuff alive and well....

Just get a Lotta roots......
Don't matter where they are...
After a season or 2 in 8822, you'll have roots close to the trunk.

Scratch away the dirt from the surface roots! Let's see what you got!

Sorce

 

[Nwaite]

Thanks for the good info guys.

I'm going to go walk around the swamps in the woods across the road... maby I'll find some better looking stuff out that way.

I was in some old chopping (clear cutting) last night an figured I would find some better stuff... maby some nice stumps that started having new growth. ..all I got was prickers on my good (if ya know what I mean).

 

[M. Frary]

Get out,drive around. Check fence rows and farm land for trees like elm and hawthorns. Swamps for tamarack,spruce and fir. And in between,with some moisture but not saturated hornbeam.

 

[rockm]

FWIW, it takes a while to recognize collectible trees. It's not about finding a perfect dwarf specimen on some pristine hillside.

What you are looking for is an interesting TRUNK, not a tree. The magic rule for collection is finding one that has movement, interest within THE FIRST 24-30 inches--the remainder of the tree is COMPLETELY BESIDE THE POINT.

DON'T think weird and odd looking is "great" It ain't. Common mistake for people just starting out. The twisted root sucker is one of those. Weird is weird and not all that great for bonsai. Bonsai are not twisted, ugly little trees. That is a stereotype. They are supposed to be natural or natural looking.

Decent collection areas tend NOT to be inside the forest, but at the fringes, or in disturbed areas. Blow downs, along roads that are sporadically used (unused roads don't produce very good candidates. You WANT trees that have been smashed, run over or pushed aside. That can produce character and do some of the preliminary bonsai work for you by shortening trunks, inducing forced taper, produce scarring and limit root run.

Exposed western slopes on hills or low mountains can also produce some interesting trees, as those stay hot in the summer and face direct sun for most of the year. Rocky areas are a given, but digging can be a big issue.

Speaking of digging, even if you find a good tree worth digging out of the hundreds you will be looking at, it may not be collectible. Digging it may be more trouble than it's worth. A good measure I've found in determining if a tree is going to come home with me without giving me a hernia or require dynamite to remove is to shove the trunk HARD with your hand about two feet from the ground. If the trunk doesn't move at all at ground level, or you hurt you hand shoving an immovable object, forget it. If the trunk gives a 1/2 inch or more at ground level, there is a chance it is a candidate.

Also when you're looking at trees, get down on your hands, knees, stomach and scratch away AT LEAST two inches of surface dirt from the tree's trunk, the deeper you can get the better in a circle seven or eight inches out from the trunk. This will give you a good view of the "true" trunk and eventual nebari. You should note that you can discover some jaw dropping nebari OR you can find really really bad inverse taper, tiered root systems and other crap that can take decades to work out.

BE CAREFUL when you're crawling around. Rattlesnakes, copperheads, plain old snakes, black widow spiders and other critters can be underneath trees, especially on warm hillsides in early spring...

 

[CWTurner]

shove the trunk HARD with your hand about two feet from the ground.

Great advice. Some trees just ain't coming out of the ground.

snakes, black widow spiders and other critters

And bears...I'm always worried about bears especially after seeing The Revenant.
CW

 

[rockm]

Bears don't worry me much. Coyotes, rabid foxes and raccoons are more of a danger where I live. Although we get bear sightings as close as five miles from the Capital every spring and fall.

I used to live in an area in Virginia were "There was a bear on the porch this morning and I couldn't leave the house for a spell" was a valid excuse for tardiness at school, though.

 

[Cypress187]

I would collect them all, just in case, as a backup, or for trading.

 

[Nwaite]

I would collect them all, just in case, as a backup, or for trading.

I was thinking about this to... but.

I would really like to train my eyes and mind to pick out the really good ones. I don't know if I'll be able to do that's until I force that disiplin upon myself. By saying no nit this one nope not this one ether. ..

Oh yaaa there she is . The one iv been looking for all week.

Then I take it home and show every one well they give me a blank stare and wondering why the fuck in digging up stumps in the woods and getting excited about it.

I do have a really hard time to identify young trees. any one know of a good book or website that would help with that?

 

[sorce]

Virginia tech got a good tree app.

I think Oso showed us that.

This is good too!
http://oplin.org/tree/

Sorce

 

[rockm]

I was thinking about this to... but.

I would really like to train my eyes and mind to pick out the really good ones. I don't know if I'll be able to do that's until I force that disiplin upon myself. By saying no nit this one nope not this one ether. ..

Oh yaaa there she is . The one iv been looking for all week.

Then I take it home and show every one well they give me a blank stare and wondering why the fuck in digging up stumps in the woods and getting excited about it.

I do have a really hard time to identify young trees. any one know of a good book or website that would help with that?

You can do both at the same time--

Learn on the homelier trees at first -- they will most certainly die on you at some point as you inflict probably fatal wounds, overwater, overpot, overprune, underwater, etc. Collecting trees as some of your first bonsai material doubles your work. Collected material does not act like established material. Trying what works one could kill the other.

FWIW, when I started collecting I killed one extremely nice candidate because I didn't know WTF I was doing. Since then, I adhere to the collector's mantra of "if you're unfamiliar with the species, collect the tree NEXT to the one you want and see if you can keep it alive for a couple of years BEFORE digging the really nice one."

 

[Cypress187]

I would really like to train my eyes and mind to pick out the really good ones.

I guess they are all not collectable's as in a bonsai-masters eye. The first one could have good taper but the branch broke in the wrong spot (maybe chop it some more and collect in few years), the second one is kinda straight and young bark (as far as we can see it), and the last one is a young stick in a pot (collect in 10 years perhaps whack it some each year).

 

[Waltron]

mike makes great points, im just starting to realize the things he mentioned myself, that being said, First one should live if you dig it, seems decent enough for a bonsai experiment, I would dig the confier if I were you, I like it. would be good practice for the better ones you may encounter in the future, dont waste a full season of learning opportunity, time is of the essence in this game. ya gotta dig something right? window of opportunity is narrow.

 

[Cypress187]

This is good too!
http://oplin.org/tree/

Sorce

Wow very good this one, thanks.

 

[rockm]

I guess they are all not collectable's as in a bonsai-masters eye. The first one could have good taper but the branch broke in the wrong spot (maybe chop it some more and collect in few years), the second one is kinda straight and young bark (as far as we can see it), and the last one is a young stick in a pot (collect in 10 years perhaps whack it some each year).

No. The first one is almost the worst one. It has a nasty piece of dead wood that looks like it slants downward. That makes the tree mostly unworkable unless you're willing to either put up with a serious (and ugly) quirk, or chop it below the damage. Chopping below the damage will require about five years of unrestrained growth to match a new leader up with the trunk diameter. The trunk that remains below the chop isn't interesting enough for the fuss.

The conifer is simply too young and without any character. The even, upward rainbow curve of the trunk is just insipid and boring YAWN.....

The last tangle of roots trunks and god knows what else is Just Plain Ugly...

 

[Cypress187]

No. The first one is almost the worst one. It has a nasty piece of dead wood that looks like it slants downward. That makes the tree mostly unworkable unless you're willing to either put up with a serious (and ugly) quirk, or chop it below the damage. Chopping below the damage will require about five years of unrestrained growth to match a new leader up with the trunk diameter. The trunk that remains below the chop isn't interesting enough for the fuss.
The conifer is simply too young and without any character. The even, upward rainbow curve of the trunk is just insipid and boring YAWN.....The last tangle of roots trunks and god knows what else is Just Plain Ugly...

This was kinda what i ment, i was going to say this next