Lobaeux
Shohin
Looks fantastic KingJades. My S-shaped elm has taken a dramatic turn. I'll take a pic when I get home.
S-shaped Chinese elm?
- Thread starter Lobaeux
- Start date
just.wing.it
Deadwood Head
That's a nice one!
I don't think it's too much bending, maybe the tree as a whole is a little tall tho....
Looks like fun!
KingJades
Shohin
Probably a little tall still, but it's in development for a thicker trunk so it comes with the territory.
I've also never had an elm so I can practice pruning on the development growth a little to familiarize myself while it grows.
It probably has an air layer above the first curve in its future.
I got one of these as my first too, after realising its issues.
I air layered mine and have a topic documenting my whole journey through that. The base certain benefits from the air layer... My top half went very bad looking for a bit, but its just now bounced back and pushed out growth everywhere and is looking a lot better. It still has a long way to go, to get some good strong roots and establish in the pot, but its looking good at the moment.
I can post a few pics of its progression, if you would like.
Lobaeux
Shohin
Yeah, I'd definitley like to see progression pics.
Zach Smith
Omono
One thing to keep in mind in regard to "growing out" the S-curve is that Chinese elms do not put on taper voluntarily, so even if you do manage to soften the S through growth you'll most likely be left with an untapering trunk. Fixing the S is usually best done by picking a spot and chopping, then regrowing - rinse and repeat as the tree puts on trunk heft.
KingJades
Shohin
Out of curiosity, why the heck is EVERY elm for sale formed into an S? It's essentially impossible to find a normally cultured upright with a little movement short of higher end stuff.
Fukien Tea & Chinese Elm are both essentially impossible to find outside of those forms.
Fukien Tea & Chinese Elm are both essentially impossible to find outside of those forms.
Lobaeux
Shohin
I think I read somewhere that they're squished down that way so that more can be packaged for resale. Sounded dubious to me, but maybe.
I have a little Mame Fukien tree that is upright, no S curve.
KingJades
Shohin
I realize that it's possible. 
I had one, too, but I sold it. I rooted two stems as cuttings and they're going to grow toward uprights since I generally like those.
I had one, too, but I sold it. I rooted two stems as cuttings and they're going to grow toward uprights since I generally like those.
Lobaeux
Shohin
My Fukien Tea isn't an S shape either.
Ironbeaver
Chumono
They're farmed that way, the saplings are just bent around stakes rather than wired. It's cheap and creates what is perceived as a bonsai shape.
Lobaeux
Shohin
Here is my S-Shaped Elm in its current state. It was weed whacked a few months ago and I pulled it out of the ground and put it in this pot. The branch on the outside of the curve is growing like a weed, the top is pretty much a goner. I'll cut it soon. Not sure this is going to amount to anything other than some learning about elms.
Lobaeux
Shohin
And here's my Fukien getting some sun this morning. He's a little shaggy, gonna have to do some trimming on him.
Ok well here is a progression...
My original tree, maybe month or so after bought on the 13th of March.
The air layer plans, after getting peoples opinions in a topic and I think Sorce made a plan before me.
The girdle, which I thought was quite cleanly done for a first timer like myself.
The air layer section all packaged.
Taking the packaging off to chop and plant.
Planted in its new pot, far from fancy looking.
Continued in next post...
Here is the bottom half that remained in the pot.
It was at this stage the top half went rather down hill for a month or so, looking very bad. To a first timer, it looked terrible but people did say it was ok and I checked bits and seemed ok. Just looked bad. I don't have a pic of it looking fully terrible but this next pic was when new green buds started showing up and things looked hopeful! You can see the mass amount of leaves its lost since chopping.
And these are both taken today, they both look a lot better. Top half has exploded with loads of new leaves.
And the bottom half has nice new, good looking growth too. Im now pruning them a lot more, following Smoke's advice on keeping all branches short. Also the soil looks a bit green due to some rain we had, and its been damp weather, I think any way... Someone can feel free to correct me if its something else.
It was at this stage the top half went rather down hill for a month or so, looking very bad. To a first timer, it looked terrible but people did say it was ok and I checked bits and seemed ok. Just looked bad. I don't have a pic of it looking fully terrible but this next pic was when new green buds started showing up and things looked hopeful! You can see the mass amount of leaves its lost since chopping.
And these are both taken today, they both look a lot better. Top half has exploded with loads of new leaves.
And the bottom half has nice new, good looking growth too. Im now pruning them a lot more, following Smoke's advice on keeping all branches short. Also the soil looks a bit green due to some rain we had, and its been damp weather, I think any way... Someone can feel free to correct me if its something else.
2 big things I learn't...
Make the wrapping or pot you are using to house the girdled, air layer site BIGGER. Mine was too small and it meant roots had less room to grow. The more roots that have grown, the bigger success of air layering and also more leaves you can keep on top. Which leads me to the second thing...
I didn't trim or prune anything on the top half when repotted. I believe this is what lead to the MASS leaf drop and it looking terrible. The new, small root system could not handle all of those leaves and branchs. So, need to prune back in accordance with the amount of new roots you have grown in the air layer.
I made sure to do with this my pyracantha air layer that I did around same time. So far its doing well, some leaf drop but its still early days for that one.
Make the wrapping or pot you are using to house the girdled, air layer site BIGGER. Mine was too small and it meant roots had less room to grow. The more roots that have grown, the bigger success of air layering and also more leaves you can keep on top. Which leads me to the second thing...
I didn't trim or prune anything on the top half when repotted. I believe this is what lead to the MASS leaf drop and it looking terrible. The new, small root system could not handle all of those leaves and branchs. So, need to prune back in accordance with the amount of new roots you have grown in the air layer.
I made sure to do with this my pyracantha air layer that I did around same time. So far its doing well, some leaf drop but its still early days for that one.
KingJades
Shohin
Great progressions, guys. Appreciate the input!
Sometimes I forget that trunk chopping is part of *most* bonsai experiences and don't think twice about doing it to other trees. It's probably because I subconsciously buy into the S as "styled" and by chopping I'm affecting the "style" of the tree. In reality we're fixing the nursery stock no more than any other fix we do to trees and don't bat an eye at.
Sometimes I forget that trunk chopping is part of *most* bonsai experiences and don't think twice about doing it to other trees. It's probably because I subconsciously buy into the S as "styled" and by chopping I'm affecting the "style" of the tree. In reality we're fixing the nursery stock no more than any other fix we do to trees and don't bat an eye at.
Lobaeux
Shohin
@ConorDash the progression is fantastic!
Lobaeux
Shohin
Do I have a new leader or a false hope? Where do I cut?
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