Soil Question
- Thread starter daniel
- Start date
I have actually never been able to grow outdoors as I never had the space. Not even a fire escape.
I replicate weather with a humidifier, humidistat, exhaust fan, reptile heater, and a "wind" fan for circulation. Your quite correct.. very little fluctuations exist since all these are set on timers ect.. My trees summer is almost the same is their winter.. All tropical trees.
For my mix components I order from here repotme.com they are mainly an orchid site but have just all the soil mix components you can think of using for bonsai including pumice and lava rock.
http://www.repotme.com/orchid-media/index.html
Anonymous User
Banned
http://coloradolava.com/soil_amendment.htm
Call them and they will give you a local distributor.
Wil
daniel
Mame
...and that climate would be...?
Sorry Zone 5B. Cold wet winters and hot dry summers. Dries out in about 1-2 days in summer, stays moist for 4-7 days in the winter if left outside.
shohin kid
Shohin
I like Akadama the best. I put mostly everything in it and like how easy it is to tell if it needs water. Since I only have 1 tree that is not shohin it isn't that expensive, but you pay for the quality that you get with akadama. Plus, it depends where a person lives, in St. Louis it is very humid so akadama is the perfect thing to use.
I agree. I started using Akadama as part of my soil mix this year, and I've seen a dramatic change in growth over the calcined clay. Those Japanese have some special dirt over there. I had an Hinoki at a local show and it was next to another planted in "rocks"(lava, turface, and bark). Everyone commented on the spectacular color of my tree vs. the other one. My mix is Spagnum Peat Moss, Akadama, and builders sand (not sifted. For conifers I use 50% builders sand and 50% akadama.
And yes, this is the Warren Hill mix. Huge growth difference so far this year though.
Bill S
Masterpiece
shohin kid & cquinn may I ask where you live, I agree to a point re akadama, but you really should stay away from using it where it will freeze, the cycles cause the akadama to turn to mush after a couple of years, not a problem if you are repotting every 2 years, but could be a killer after that. At least from what I have read and seen, my use has been with the 2 line kind that is supposed to be more able to stand up to time, but I find it will break easily when wet, unlike a turface granule.
daniel
Mame
I agree. I started using Akadama as part of my soil mix this year, and I've seen a dramatic change in growth over the calcined clay. Those Japanese have some special dirt over there. I had an Hinoki at a local show and it was next to another planted in "rocks"(lava, turface, and bark). Everyone commented on the spectacular color of my tree vs. the other one. My mix is Spagnum Peat Moss, Akadama, and builders sand (not sifted. For conifers I use 50%builders sand and 50% akadama.
And yes, this is the Warren Hill mix. Huge growth difference so far this year though.
Does the above mix work as well as you say with deciduous trees (since it seems you only used it with conifers)? I don't do evergreens, so I'm curious. As I stated, I'm using Brussel's mix, but I'm considering using Erik Wigert's mix, which seemed to have pine bark, lava rock and possibly some type of clay. I know, I should try and see what works, but I want to try and avoid mistakes others have made, if I can!
Daniel
Does the above mix work as well as you say with deciduous trees (since it seems you only used it with conifers)? I don't do evergreens, so I'm curious. As I stated, I'm using Brussel's mix, but I'm considering using Erik Wigert's mix, which seemed to have pine bark, lava rock and possibly some type of clay. I know, I should try and see what works, but I want to try and avoid mistakes others have made, if I can!
Daniel
Spagmum Peat Moss, Akadama, and builder's sand for decidous.
FourMileMarc
Mame
The best thing I discovered about growing anything in a container is that there is no such thing as overwatering.
Only lack of O2.
The idea is to use a mix coarse enough that you can water everything at least once a day. Running a "flush" of water through the roots oxigenates the rootzone every morning and your roots will grow like crazy. I am noticing the best results ever this year on all my trees from pines to maples. I use 50% pumice or red lava rock 1/4 inch, 25% mini fir bark (does not break down very fast) and 25% fox farms happy frog potting soil and finally crushed long strand sphagnum moss. The moss allows me to be unable to water for a day under most temperatures and provides good aeration and takes a long time to break down. Breakdown time is critical if you plan to have the tree in the same container for more than one year.
Think about a hydroponic system. The tree's are submersed in water. The water however is not standing. It is constantly being infused with air and circulated. The plants do great in this environment. Aeroponics is another example using no soil medium.
It does not matter what you use as long as you have big enough pour spaces in the root zone. The bigger the better although you need to weight that againsd convenience. You could grow in 1 inch granite boulders as long as you could keep your hose on it all day, mixed with a nutrient solution of course.
My water bill has gone through the roof That is the only downside.
and the water Natzies are going on patrol soon to make shure I am not watering on the off days.
Only lack of O2.
The idea is to use a mix coarse enough that you can water everything at least once a day. Running a "flush" of water through the roots oxigenates the rootzone every morning and your roots will grow like crazy. I am noticing the best results ever this year on all my trees from pines to maples. I use 50% pumice or red lava rock 1/4 inch, 25% mini fir bark (does not break down very fast) and 25% fox farms happy frog potting soil and finally crushed long strand sphagnum moss. The moss allows me to be unable to water for a day under most temperatures and provides good aeration and takes a long time to break down. Breakdown time is critical if you plan to have the tree in the same container for more than one year.
Think about a hydroponic system. The tree's are submersed in water. The water however is not standing. It is constantly being infused with air and circulated. The plants do great in this environment. Aeroponics is another example using no soil medium.
It does not matter what you use as long as you have big enough pour spaces in the root zone. The bigger the better although you need to weight that againsd convenience. You could grow in 1 inch granite boulders as long as you could keep your hose on it all day, mixed with a nutrient solution of course.
My water bill has gone through the roof
That is the only downside.and the water Natzies are going on patrol soon to make shure I am not watering on the off days.
I live in Northwest Georgia. I helped Warren repot some of his big maple forests in March, and the akadama was still whole, except for the bits that the beautiful white roots were growing through. That seems to be the difference, roots grow through akadama, while they grow around the clay. I believe that there is too much hysteria over root rot to the point where nutrition takes a back seat. Also, when soil falls off of the root ball because it's so loose that isn't necessarily good either. I'm just reporting the results I've gotten so far though. I figure if the Japanese are planting $50K trees in it, then it's good enough for me. Japan's climate is very similar to mine here.
daniel
Mame
Equal parts?
daniel
Mame
Ok, so I think I'd like to use akadama clay in making my own mix. A couple of questions come to mind:
First, what is there to look for? I have already noticed after a cursory search that there is a great price differential among seemingly equal products. Is there a particular "brand?" Or something else to look for, outside of particle size?
Second, I think I understand that particle size is pretty much directly related to bonsai size? Right?
Last, is there a particularly good retailer or one that has a great price that most go to?
Thanks!
Daniel
First, what is there to look for? I have already noticed after a cursory search that there is a great price differential among seemingly equal products. Is there a particular "brand?" Or something else to look for, outside of particle size?
Second, I think I understand that particle size is pretty much directly related to bonsai size? Right?
Last, is there a particularly good retailer or one that has a great price that most go to?
Thanks!
Daniel
shohin kid
Shohin
I live in St. Louis, Missouri. Akadama is best used in humid places, and boy is St. Louis humid. Japan is very humid too. So if you do not live in a place that is very humid, then one may consider using a soil that can hold a little more water. I use an akadama pre-mix which is put together in japan and imported to my local bonsai nursery. Since akadama doesn't really hold water, I have not had any problems with it in winter. I have everything but my pre-bonsai in akadama and my deciduous trees do fine, especially my two specimen shohin japanese maples. I am no expert but everything in akadama seems to best fit the needs of at least my trees. To answer you questions daniel, I would put it in some sort of premix rather than straight akadama. I would tell you the brand of my premix but I can not read japanese. The second question you have right, and the last question I would have to say a local nursery. Hope I helped some, shohin kid
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Yes, equal parts.
I like the double line brand. The small particle size is fine for bonsai through Chuhin size. After that go to medium (this is from my own experience so far). See the below link. These people are the best, especially Karen.
http://www.bonsaimonk.com
daniel
Mame
Thanks, Shohin kid. I live in Louisville, KY, so I'm right there with you in terms of humidity...
Is this too expensive for pre-bonsai? Is that why you choose not to use it? Or, do they do better in other medium? (I have a bunch of pre-bonsai that are going to need to be potted, so I thought I'd ask.)
Also, which is better (or is there much of a difference)--high fired or akadama "soil?"
Thanks all for your answers. I appreciate your help!
Daniel
Is this too expensive for pre-bonsai? Is that why you choose not to use it? Or, do they do better in other medium? (I have a bunch of pre-bonsai that are going to need to be potted, so I thought I'd ask.)
Also, which is better (or is there much of a difference)--high fired or akadama "soil?"
Thanks all for your answers. I appreciate your help!
Daniel
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shohin kid
Shohin
daniel,
the bag I buy is $40, but if you have the money go for it. I recently made a switch to akadama so I will be in the process of transitioning most of my good stuff, pre-bonsai included, into it. I only things I don't use akadama for are my experiment plants. So things like gardencenter or homedepot trees. In other words, if the tree has great potential, than I think the better quality soil is needed, if its a practice tree or experiment tree that will one day be given away when refining one's collection, save the money.
the bag I buy is $40, but if you have the money go for it. I recently made a switch to akadama so I will be in the process of transitioning most of my good stuff, pre-bonsai included, into it. I only things I don't use akadama for are my experiment plants. So things like gardencenter or homedepot trees. In other words, if the tree has great potential, than I think the better quality soil is needed, if its a practice tree or experiment tree that will one day be given away when refining one's collection, save the money.
I do not know the answer to this question. Sorry, shohin kid
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