Two collected elms I assumed were American but having doubts. Id help please.

[Asymetrix]

Sorry for another elm ID thread but this one's interesting to me.

Collected these elms in the spring. I assumed they were Ulmus Americana or Ulmus Rubrum but the bark is drastically different.

It is light grey. Corky and fissured. They do not have any wings nor did they when I collected them. The larger of the two was much older than expected. Between 40-50 years of growth rings.

Both were near creek banks or bottoms. I live in southern Illinois near St. Louis.

I was reading about Ulmus Serotina or the September Elm which is endemic to Tennessee but has some small numbers in southern Illinois.

Any help or information appreciated. I realize elms can be hard to ID.

 

[Asymetrix]

Having issues with pictures.

 

[berzerkules]

If no one here can get you a positive ID there are a handful of tree id fb groups that I've had success with.

Good luck getting an ID

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Well... American elm and September elm are "virtually identical" when it comes to leaf appearance. They both have double serrate leaves, which sets them apart from most other elm species. September elm, however, blooms in September (versus spring for American elm). Both are highly susceptible to Dutch elm disease, so they are less common in the wild than they once were. September elm is only rarely found outside of Tennessee.

 

[ShadyStump]

I started a thread a while back for plant ID app reviews, and my preferred one- LeafSnap- came up with ulmus minor or parvifolia as top choices. Used both the leaf and bark settings, hence the discrepancy. They're main server also seems to be down, so who knows.

 

[CasAH]

My grandfather was born in French Village.

 

[Asymetrix]

My grandfather was born in French Village.

Literally live right next to it.

 

[Mikecheck123]

Sorry for another elm ID thread but this one's interesting to me.

Collected these elms in the spring. I assumed they were Ulmus Americana or Ulmus Rubrum but the bark is drastically different.

It is light grey. Corky and fissured. They do not have any wings nor did they when I collected them. The larger of the two was much older than expected. Between 40-50 years of growth rings.View attachment 394592

Both were near creek banks or bottoms. I live in southern Illinois near St. Louis.

I was reading about Ulmus Serotina or the September Elm which is endemic to Tennessee but has some small numbers in southern Illinois.

Any help or information appreciated. I realize elms can be hard to ID.

Probably a Siberian elm.

Check out the middle right bark picture here:

Chinese Elm vs Siberian Elm

Chinese elm trees are one of the great landscaping trees that we have available in North America. They are tough to kill, adaptable to any soil and watering conditions, and are generally pest and dis

www.natesnursery.com

 

[Bonsai Nut]

I started a thread a while back for plant ID app reviews, and my preferred one- LeafSnap- came up with ulmus minor or parvifolia as top choices. Used both the leaf and bark settings, hence the discrepancy. They're main server also seems to be down, so who knows.

Well... at least they got the genus right

 

[ShadyStump]

Probably a Siberian elm.

Check out the middle right bark picture here:

Chinese Elm vs Siberian Elm

Chinese elm trees are one of the great landscaping trees that we have available in North America. They are tough to kill, adaptable to any soil and watering conditions, and are generally pest and dis

www.natesnursery.com

SOOOO MANY of these around here, I'm pretty sure that's not it. The bark isn't right.

 

[sorce]

Definitely not an American Elm, and of theor leaves are so similar to Septelm, I'd rule that out too.

External forces can effect the look of bark, which may make it Siberian, but it seems more a hybrid Siberian.

Most important....does it matter?

Sorce

 

[Asymetrix]

Its definitely not a Siberian elm. The leaves are 2-3 inches long on both of them.

I have 2 Siberians and both have leaves under 1 inch.

It matters to me yes. Only because I would want to represent the species as best I can.

External forces affecting the bark is understandable but there are other elms that are most definitely U. Americana in the same vicinity with the correct bark.

 

[Asymetrix]

Probably a Siberian elm.

Check out the middle right bark picture here:

Chinese Elm vs Siberian Elm

Chinese elm trees are one of the great landscaping trees that we have available in North America. They are tough to kill, adaptable to any soil and watering conditions, and are generally pest and dis

www.natesnursery.com

Leaves are 2-3 inches. I have 2 Siberians both have leaves under 1 inch.

Also one of these I literally dug out of the water a foot deep.

U. Pumila does not tolerate flood or lowland conditions.

 

[Mikecheck123]

Leaves are 2-3 inches. I have 2 Siberians both have leaves under 1 inch.

Also one of these I literally dug out of the water a foot deep.

U. Pumila does not tolerate flood or lowland conditions.

3 inches is well within the normal range.

If it's not a pure Siberian, it's probably a hybrid with slippery elm.

I have one of those hybrids and it's been maddening trying to figure it out.