What's a fair price for a pre-bonsai maple?

Shogun610

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I scour FB auctions mostly 99 cent or pot auctions for gems that get swallowed up fast. But alas only few more weeks and the lamenting will be gone since I’ll finally be able to repot, collect , air layer , nursery crawl, fbook marketplace crawl once again. Plus the activities / stuff I’ll have my eyes on at the studio… it’s a great pleasure every weekend being surrounded by tons of bonsai.
I wrestle with it a lot in the auctions in terms of if I try and put myself in the sellers shoes, and don’t get me wrong there are a good amount of great sellers on the auctions that are consistent … but it’s a mix bag week to week.
 
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River's Edge

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Shishigara Maples, purchased from landscape nursery for $129 and $149 each respectively. Approximately 8 feet tall to begin with / chopped and developed for five years so far! Some portions air layered off in the first two years as the root ball was worked and the trees reduced. Some thread grafting done and more may be required. A few scars to heal and need to continue branch development for design. Lets say a basic start with rough potential! trunk size above the base approximately 3 1/2 inches at this point.
Note: not pretending high quality, just showing what is possible in five years starting with landscape nursery stock. I am certain many could do better in the same period of time.
Biggest benefit of doing it this way is you really learn to appreciate it when you see high quality at a reasonable price. You have a much better idea of how hard it actually is. And how easily the branches can break on this species. Oh and the time spent is more easily understood.
 

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dbonsaiw

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Rather than asking “is this tree worth $500?” We could ask, “has somebody put $500 of effort into this tree?”
Not sure I agree. I have put well over $500 of time, effort and money into my trees. They are not worth that and nobody would/should pay that amount. Not to be a jerk, but I pay for results not effort. And frankly, who are these types of trees being marketed to? I doubt Walter Pall and his ilk would ever give this a second look. It's being marketed to nubes who are like "wow, are those fertilizer containers on the soil". I guess I'm having one of those days, but I pledge to stick my rejects in the ground and let mother nature deal with them rather than try to make a few bucks off unsuspecting nubes on the web. That said, if anyone wants a big box tree that I butchered for $500, I'll consider it. Lol.
 

leatherback

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Not sure I agree. I have put well over $500 of time, effort and money into my trees. They are not worth that and nobody would/should pay that amount. Not to be a jerk, but I pay for results not effort. And frankly, who are these types of trees being marketed to? I doubt Walter Pall and his ilk would ever give this a second look. It's being marketed to nubes who are like "wow, are those fertilizer containers on the soil". I guess I'm having one of those days, but I pledge to stick my rejects in the ground and let mother nature deal with them rather than try to make a few bucks off unsuspecting nubes on the web. That said, if anyone wants a big box tree that I butchered for $500, I'll consider it. Lol.
You have Box BOx Trees? Sell me one :)
 

parhamr

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Not sure I agree. I have put well over $500 of time, effort and money into my trees. They are not worth that and nobody would/should pay that amount. Not to be a jerk, but I pay for results not effort. And frankly, who are these types of trees being marketed to? I doubt Walter Pall and his ilk would ever give this a second look. It's being marketed to nubes who are like "wow, are those fertilizer containers on the soil". I guess I'm having one of those days, but I pledge to stick my rejects in the ground and let mother nature deal with them rather than try to make a few bucks off unsuspecting nubes on the web. That said, if anyone wants a big box tree that I butchered for $500, I'll consider it. Lol.
I hear you. We are in agreement.

I think you missed my tone or intent. I am aware that it’s a tall ask, that tree isn’t worth it, and that nobody really regularly receives “fair market value” for the effort put in.
 

Mapleminx

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From what I have seen in another thread Mr Maple has a large selection for really low prices, not just maples but other trees too.
Sorry if this source has already been mentioned but I didn’t have time to scroll through 6 pages.
 

19Mateo83

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From what I have seen in another thread Mr Maple has a large selection for really low prices, not just maples but other trees too.
Sorry if this source has already been mentioned but I didn’t have time to scroll through 6 pages.
All mr maple trees, 3 shishigashira, 2 deshojo, Lima gold dwarf, seriyu and summer gold. All are their one gallon size except for the shishigashiras which were two gallon size. Lots of potential in their little trees but also a lot of work but great for an inexpensive starter Japanese maple.
 

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dbonsaiw

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Hate to call folks out, but..... This is a pic of a tree I saw online today. Asking price is $1,600.00!!!!!!! For that price, a few more pics would have been appreciated. Maybe they should show off that $1,600.00 nebari. I know, time value of money and effort and all that jazz, but I get the impression folks are trying to take advantage of tourists, not foster long-term clients. I also called a local bonsai shop for some maple seedlings. Was told they were $50, but he would give it to me for $40. Highway robbery.

Sorry to say that I truly do not believe any self respecting bonsai enthusiast is purchasing trees from any of these popular online bonsai shops. I seriously tempted to drive from NY to Virginia to check out a bonsai show and maybe pick up something worth posting a pic of.
 

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dbonsaiw

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A little off topic as they don't seem to have maples, but I came across New World Bonsai yesterday on Etsy and got myself two Zelkovas for $22/per. They are young plants. Never dealt with them before, but they have an interesting selection.
 

SeanS

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Not pre-bonsai in the true sense, the roots will need major work come next spring, but I picked up this landscape trident this weekend for the equivalent of $14. Has a 3-4” base under the soil and a bunch of low shoots.

1531E7B8-9FA2-4F26-ABB1-26D83231944C.jpeg

And a few weeks ago I picked up this guy for the equivalent of $20

42C58696-80D7-4B5F-9EB2-4D0A0A2219F8.jpeg
 

rockm

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Hate to call folks out, but..... This is a pic of a tree I saw online today. Asking price is $1,600.00!!!!!!! For that price, a few more pics would have been appreciated. Maybe they should show off that $1,600.00 nebari. I know, time value of money and effort and all that jazz, but I get the impression folks are trying to take advantage of tourists, not foster long-term clients. I also called a local bonsai shop for some maple seedlings. Was told they were $50, but he would give it to me for $40. Highway robbery.

Sorry to say that I truly do not believe any self respecting bonsai enthusiast is purchasing trees from any of these popular online bonsai shops. I seriously tempted to drive from NY to Virginia to check out a bonsai show and maybe pick up something worth posting a pic of.
You do know Bill Valavanis has a bonsai nursery in Rochester?--he's got all kinds of Japanese maples, from seedlings to hugely expensive. Might be worth a visit to his place or a look at his seedling catalogue.

Also Matt Ouwinga at Kaede Bonsai in Maryland sells thousands of Japanese-sourced seedlings (he imports trident maple seed and grows trees himself).


Now is the time to order from both sources if you're interested
 

dbonsaiw

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You do know Bill Valavanis has a bonsai nursery in Rochester?
I actually did not. Bill's name is surely one that I heard many times here, but I have yet to figure out who's who. Much thanks for the referral, I am checking these out.
 

dbonsaiw

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Awesome stuff and fair prices. I picked up some seedlings and looking at other items. Now if my trees only grew as quick as I spend money on this hobby.......
 

dbonsaiw

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Also Matt Ouwinga at Kaede Bonsai in Maryland sells thousands of Japanese-sourced seedlings (he imports trident maple seed and grows trees himself).
Took your advice and just received a japanese black pine and a koto hime maple from him. Price was right and the trees are nice. After receiving a zelkova in the mail from another source that was partially bare-rooted and wrapped in newspaper (no pot), it was quite nice to finally receive trees from a real bonsai supplier. Not only did they come in pots (duh!) but they were in bonsai soil. I understand my Valavanis trees will arrive closer to spring. These recommendations were eye-opening. Now let's grow some trees.
 

dbonsaiw

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You do know Bill Valavanis has a bonsai nursery in Rochester?--
Just received my trees from Mr. Valavanis yesterday. I am so pleased - exceeded expectations. And will be getting more as I know I will kick myself years down the line for not putting more of these starter trees in a pot.
 
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