All aboard the Mugo train!

[Waldo]

I am pretty new to this forum as well. I think like in so many learning environments, at times, you will get impatient, sarcastic, and condescending replies. Try not to be discouraged. I think there are no bad questions. And there are many people on here that are very knowledgeable and and willing to share that with you. Sometimes you have to be patient and wait for posts that will be helpful. Not all of them will be. It would appear that you are pursuing this in a very scientific and intelligent manner, And off to a good start. Best of luck with your Mugos.

 

[qwerty Bonsai]

As a newbie, I also worked on two nursery stocks recently.

First one is smaller, did it two weeks ago, before I saw the tutorial (- compiled posts by Vance). I probably chopped off 70-80% (or more) of the foliage, but only trimmed very small portion of the roots. Repotted it with original soil.

What is the chance that it could survive? What I still can do to improve the chance, for example, repot into a pond basket with better soil?

2nd one is bigger. (photo 2&3). I tried to follow the tutorial, reduced about 40% foliage, cut off half of the root ball. Only thing did not follow is that I don't have pond basket at hand, so squeezed it into a pot. (If I can get a pond basket 3days later, should I repot it then?)

Thanks!

 

[sorce]

As a newbie, I also worked on two nursery stocks recently.

First one is smaller, did it two weeks ago, before I saw the tutorial (- compiled posts by Vance). I probably chopped off 70-80% (or more) of the foliage, but only trimmed very small portion of the roots. Repotted it with original soil.

What is the chance that it could survive? What I still can do to improve the chance, for example, repot into a pond basket with better soil?

2nd one is bigger. (photo 2&3). I tried to follow the tutorial, reduced about 40% foliage, cut off half of the root ball. Only thing did not follow is that I don't have pond basket at hand, so squeezed it into a pot. (If I can get a pond basket 3days later, should I repot it then?)

Thanks!

No offense, but it doesn't seem you have anything stand out magical, so you're better off leaving them, and learning what you can from these actions.

I understand (arguably better than anyone) what it is to have a small budget. That said, I estimate these can grow for up to 5 years, within which you will be able to find better material to throw in a pond basket and do things correct.

You will already know what to expect when THOSE finally get in pots. This is the benefit of your current situation. Enjoy it.

Sorce

 

[nutshell]

Were about to find out how much these can take. 30%? 50? I went for 90.
Bought at discount due to fungal infection and needle tip borers earlier this summer. Had begun back budding already due to these issues.
Lopped 7/25, zone 6.
Frogs be with him.

 

[qwerty Bonsai]

No offense, but it doesn't seem you have anything stand out magical, so you're better off leaving them, and learning what you can from these actions.

I understand (arguably better than anyone) what it is to have a small budget. That said, I estimate these can grow for up to 5 years, within which you will be able to find better material to throw in a pond basket and do things correct.

You will already know what to expect when THOSE finally get in pots. This is the benefit of your current situation. Enjoy it.

Sorce

So the best option that would increase the possibility of their survival is to leave them as is? Thanks!

 

[Leo in N E Illinois]

Were about to find out how much these can take. 30%? 50? I went for 90.
Bought at discount due to fungal infection and needle tip borers earlier this summer. Had begun back budding already due to these issues.
Lopped 7/25, zone 6.
Frogs be with him.
View attachment 318809View attachment 318810View attachment 318811

Good Luck, this tree will need it. It might survive. Chances are it will not make it through the winter. Though one should remain hopeful.

 

[nutshell]

Good Luck, this tree will need it. It might survive. Chances are it will not make it through the winter. Though one should remain hopeful.

Yeah, cut a few flush before I knew better too. Figured it didn't have much chance either way though. We shall see.

 

[Japonicus]

@Vance Wood Mugo grafted to Scots pine
repot Spring or now?

 

[geekyalias]

Where!? We gotta go rag em. A lot of people still don't know this difference, and many of them are Pros on other platforms.

The worst that could happen is your definition of a "second flush" will change to be just "new buds forming". That's the only difference.

Sorce

Looks like that is exactly what is the confusion, a second flush of buds, not of growth, but not so clear in this guide.

Bonsai

Large Website located in the UK, Bonsai4me offers Bonsai Art, Species guides for Bonsai trees, Bonsai galleries and Bonsai Techniques.

bonsai4me.com

 

[Hartinez]

Hey @Japonicus figured I’d post a few pics here so as to not Hijack your thread. This tree was always a bit leggy but has produced quite a few back buds. The needle cast at least I think is getting worse. I treated with daconil twice this summer and was obviously not enough. It’s still got a ton of buds though. The plan has been to allow all of the back buds to mature to chase the foliage closer to the trunk. If they all survive it shouldn’t be a problem. Anyways, I think I will try a systemic here sooner than later. Unless @Vance Wood has an opinion? If you look closely at the third pic, you’ll see the back buds. And the tips off all of the tufts of needles are loaded with buds.

 

[Japonicus]

Hey @Japonicus figured I’d post a few pics here so as to not Hijack your thread. This tree was always a bit leggy but has produced quite a few back buds. The needle cast at least I think is getting worse. I treated with daconil twice this summer and was obviously not enough. It’s still got a ton of buds though. The plan has been to allow all of the back buds to mature to chase the foliage closer to the trunk. If they all survive it shouldn’t be a problem. Anyways, I think I will try a systemic here sooner than later. Unless @Vance Wood has an opinion? If you look closely at the third pic, you’ll see the back buds. And the tips off all of the tufts of needles are loaded with buds.View attachment 322353View attachment 322354
View attachment 322355

Yes there's just no sense, in just hoping Winter doesn't set it back permanently if trying to get a systemic into the cells of the tree now
could possibly give you some bullets in the war. I'd drench the foliage in Phyton 27 and use Bonide.
+Then you'll have it on hand and be familiar with it come Spring too.

How ya feeding it?

 

[Hartinez]

Yes there's just no sense, in just hoping Winter doesn't set it back permanently if trying to get a systemic into the cells of the tree now
could possibly give you some bullets in the war. I'd drench the foliage in Phyton 27 and use Bonide.
+Then you'll have it on hand and be familiar with it come Spring too.

How ya feeding it?

Sumo cakes every 4-6 weeks and a biweekly 10-10-10 organic liquid fert. I pulled back on the fertilizer with this one when the needles browned more and more.

 

[Japonicus]

Sumo cakes every 4-6 weeks and a biweekly 10-10-10 organic liquid fert. I pulled back on the fertilizer with this one when the needles browned more and more.

IDK. Do you think reducing the food contributed to any increase in vigour?
Could any perceived "increase in vigour" just be a life cycle of needle cast?
The Plant and Holly Tone I use would be faster acting than the sumo cakes,
and I rotate with different foods once each week. I feed my trees every Sunday
or closest day weather permitting. Sometimes I feed 2x/wk when I'm using fish emulsion
but definitely twice on the weeks I use Neptunes Seaweed/Fish fert combo, 2-3-1.
Would like to see you prep for Spring and Summer flush now.

 

[mpg101]

Hi all,

So far my mugo train is moving along. After 3 weeks of the repotting, they seems to have survived. As my goal for these trees is to learn various bonsai skills (pruning, wiring, horticulture of pine). I'm in the process of removing all current year growth (in progress). Per the tutorial, after pruning, bud selection is next ("Bud selection in the fall"). Will there be any buds left to select? I'm assuming the pruning will force new back buds and the buds from this new growth will appear the following fall.

After initial styling and pruning (additional 50% foliage).

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Hi all,

So far my mugo train is moving along. After 3 weeks of the repotting, they seems to have survived. As my goal for these trees is to learn various bonsai skills (pruning, wiring, horticulture of pine). I'm in the process of removing all current year growth (in progress). Per the tutorial, after pruning, bud selection is next ("Bud selection in the fall"). Will there be any buds left to select? I'm assuming the pruning will force new back buds and the buds from this new growth will appear the following fall.

After initial styling and pruning (additional 50% foliage).
View attachment 322593View attachment 322594View attachment 322595

I would do nothing more for this year.
You already removed branches and did a repot this year, right? 3 weeks is too soon to tell anything. I can cut branches off and they'll look happy and green for 6 weeks even when they're not attached to the tree anymore. That's the odd part about pine/conifer horticulture; they can take months to show they don't like something.
Don't go too fast, that's what I'm saying.

 

[mpg101]

I would do nothing more for this year.
You already removed branches and did a repot this year, right? 3 weeks is too soon to tell anything. I can cut branches off and they'll look happy and green for 6 weeks even when they're not attached to the tree anymore. That's the odd part about pine/conifer horticulture; they can take months to show they don't like something.
Don't go too fast, that's what I'm saying.

Thanks for the reminder Wires_Guy_wire, I'll leave it alone until next growing season and see how they recover from the dramatic experiences. Patience is probably the most difficult skill to achieve.

 

[Hartinez]

IDK. Do you think reducing the food contributed to any increase in vigour?
Could any perceived "increase in vigour" just be a life cycle of needle cast?
The Plant and Holly Tone I use would be faster acting than the sumo cakes,
and I rotate with different foods once each week. I feed my trees every Sunday
or closest day weather permitting. Sometimes I feed 2x/wk when I'm using fish emulsion
but definitely twice on the weeks I use Neptunes Seaweed/Fish fert combo, 2-3-1.
Would like to see you prep for Spring and Summer flush now.

I don't think so but it could be possible that contributed to the loss of vigor. And that is a great question in regards to needle cast. This is the first time I've dealt with the issue.

This is the first year I used Sumo Cakes. Some trees responded very well, others not so much. Then again, without a true control there's not telling if the results of the trees, good and bad, are a result of the cakes or not.

I looked in to the phyton 27 and hot dam that shit is not cheap. I wonder if there is a comparable product with the same active ingredient available on the market. I would prefer to buy in person but would certainly order if I needed to.

Im also expericing some tip blight on a shimpaku of mine that I should have treated for awhile ago. Its still "healthy" but needs addressing before next season begins.

 

[Wires_Guy_wires]

Thanks for the reminder Wires_Guy_wire, I'll leave it alone until next growing season and see how they recover from the dramatic experiences. Patience is probably the most difficult skill to achieve.

I speak from experience. My mugos don't die, but they keep stressing for years.
Not one, but three years. And it sucks, because I don't want to do anything until they're back to normal. In development, they don't look very nice. Patience will give you more to do in the coming year.

 

[Japonicus]

I wonder if there is a comparable product with the same active ingredient

I don't think so. Did you scroll down to the 2 Oz size? $22 USD and it will last for years
using 0.3 Tsp/Qt of water.

Phyton 27

Growers call Phyton 27 their “secret weapon” or “silver bullet” because it performs when other chemicals and controls fail.

store.phytoncorp.com

Active ingredient Copper Sulphate Pentahydrate 21.36%
Copper as metalic 5.4%. Now compare this to other copper products.
It's worth gloving up and wearing long pants and sleeves and eye protection to apply.
I think it's more expensive through Amazon last check.

I need to get some Mancozeb for my junipers, or so I think, unless the Bonide infuse will do the same???

 

[Hartinez]

I don't think so. Did you scroll down to the 2 Oz size? $22 USD and it will last for years
using 0.3 Tsp/Qt of water.

Phyton 27

Growers call Phyton 27 their “secret weapon” or “silver bullet” because it performs when other chemicals and controls fail.

store.phytoncorp.com

Active ingredient Copper Sulphate Pentahydrate 21.36%
Copper as metalic 5.4%. Now compare this to other copper products.
It's worth gloving up and wearing long pants and sleeves and eye protection to apply.
I think it's more expensive through Amazon last check.

I need to get some Mancozeb for my junipers, or so I think, unless the Bonide infuse will do the same???

Found it! Thanks Japonicus.