Ground Growing... from a distance?

[Dryad]

Spending time organizing the roots pays out in a good start for a nebari. So yeah, for species that take it, bare-rooting is the way I go.

Last year I had to plant 150 or so trident seedlings. Time was insufficient & it was hot and dry as I was planting. I have decided to use a bunch of different types of washers this year (I think I bought some 100 washers all in) and layer them. The rest I will probably lift in fall and replant.

The washer technique is one I plan on using for my deciduous seedlings. I reckon for my coniferous, I'll plant and arrange the roots on a tile, unless there is a better suggestion?

 

[Dryad]

Trees growing in low plastic nursery pots retain more feeder roots close to the trunk, especially for the first two years after sinking. Some roots will escape through the holes in the second year and get long. These are easy to cut off at the pot and easier to dig out, too. In the 3rd year all the growth is outside the pot and fewer feeder roots remain close-in. So, sink the pots and grow for two summers, not three. Start with 2nd year saplings. Use low 1 gal for the first two year cycle, low 2 gal for the next two two-year cycles, low 2 1/2 gal for cycles 4 and 5. That gets you to 10 years with compact growth. It doesn't have to end there.

Interesting, I had considered growing in pots sunk into the ground, but seeing as I won't be able to water them (bar 3 or 4 times in the spring/summer) I would be worried about the soil drying up.

Each year you chop down to a twig that can be directed "up" as a new leader by wrapping it against the trunk with a paper cup that is scotch -taped in-place. It will hold the twig upright until it gets wet a couple times and then fall off. "Up" means in a direction that will make a new leader that gives the tree some movement.

Now there's a trick I haven't heard before! That's fantastic @Forsoothe! , do you have any images of this process such that I can visualise it better? This might solve my concerns about wiring (which I know would be a terrible idea if I'm not around to remove it during the growing season).

Thank you for the advice.

 

[hinmo24t]

sounds like a fun project. bald cypress or dawn redwoods enjoy moisture - could enjoy the wet Ireland conditions

i have some developing trees in ground from public land. looked it up recently, half of USA is money-grab gov owned (paid for by you, the taxpayer)
not positive how it is in Ireland. id guess there's little true private property also; wouldnt recommend developing/digging on private property without permission.
otherwise, good chance you technically pay for most the rest of it



good luck, have to get back to paying for all the bums and bureaucrats now

 

[Forsoothe!]

Interesting, I had considered growing in pots sunk into the ground, but seeing as I won't be able to water them (bar 3 or 4 times in the spring/summer) I would be worried about the soil drying up.


Now there's a trick I haven't heard before! That's fantastic @Forsoothe! , do you have any images of this process such that I can visualise it better? This might solve my concerns about wiring (which I know would be a terrible idea if I'm not around to remove it during the growing season).

Thank you for the advice.

As long as the lip of the pot is below ground it will get as much or more water than the surrounding ground.

Here's a tiny Philodendron being toilet trained! (wrapped in a paper core from a roll of toilet paper and scotch taped together)...

In this case it is just long enough to slide down and set on the soil and still get light to the new emerging leaf. The soil is wet now and the cardboard core would wick water up and the tape would let go in the down position. Thicker cups like a paper hot cup and more tape would hold longer. Whatever you use needs to deteriorate over a short time. If it doesn't fall off and just lets go and hangs there it is probably workable, too.

 

[hinmo24t]

As long as the lip of the pot is below ground it will get as much or more water than the surrounding ground.

Here's a tiny Philodendron being toilet trained! (wrapped in a paper core from a roll of toilet paper and scotch taped together)...
View attachment 348834
In this case it is just long enough to slide down and set on the soil and still get light to the new emerging leaf. The soil is wet now and the cardboard core would wick water up and the tape would let go in the down position. Thicker cups like a paper hot cup and more tape would hold longer. Whatever you use needs to deteriorate over a short time. If it doesn't fall off and just lets go and hangs there it is probably workable, too.

thats a cool idea. i almost got claimed by some $20 of those philos, 4 times as large. i have a focal point monstera im really trying to promote otherwise id have worked on one of those. lovely little plant and pot

 

[Dryad]

not positive how it is in Ireland. id guess there's little true private property also; wouldnt recommend developing/digging on private property without permission.
otherwise, good chance you technically pay for most the rest of it

Fortunately, I can safely say this field has been in my family for generations and is 100% privately owned.

 

[Dryad]

As long as the lip of the pot is below ground it will get as much or more water than the surrounding ground.

I see, how much below ground are you talking? Also in your experience how does this compare to ground growing in a pond basket or colander?

 

[leatherback]

I see, how much below ground are you talking? Also in your experience how does this compare to ground growing in a pond basket or colander?

soils stay moist also from moisture coming up from lower layers. Putting things in a pot in the ground sounds like a terrible idea if you do not water, and a recipy for buckets of dry sand. This is besides the concwernthat the first 3 roots that escape the pot, will very quickly take over the others and become thick and swollen leaving the rest behind, more so than when all are in the ground.

Proper rootwork every so often probably does it will enough.

 

[leatherback]

my concerns about wiring

Look into directional pruning.

Planting your stock at an angle, so the trunk does not leave the ground straight, combined with directional pruning will give you all the movement you want

 

[sorce]

Post in thread 'Talk to Me About Ground Growing' https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/talk-to-me-about-ground-growing.46844/post-805057

Sorce

 

[Forsoothe!]

I see, how much below ground are you talking? Also in your experience how does this compare to ground growing in a pond basket or colander?

I've never used anything but cut-off plastic nursery pots, which I've used for 20 years. Just slightly below ground level so water would pool in rather than be blocked by the rim. A colander would allow more roots to escape and is a device for air-pruning of escaping roots when sitting on a bench.

 

[leatherback]

I've never used anything but cut-off plastic nursery pots, which I've used for 20 years. Just slightly below ground level so water would pool in rather than be blocked by the rim. A colander would allow more roots to escape and is a device for air-pruning of escaping roots when sitting on a bench.

how often do you water them?

 

[ThornBc]

I mean we live in the British Isles, it rains a lot... Unless they are in the south west, even with sunk pots, I think the plants would be fine just with rain water, given they were healthy and in a good mix, and we had a rainy spring. It's hard to tell though, we had some extreme weather in the last few years. I wouldn't use the pots just for that reason.

 

[PA_Penjing]

You're very fortunate, your country lacks diversity in trees but a lot of the trees you do have tend to work well for bonsai. field maple, all elms, scots pine (my personal favorite in the world), european larch, common juniper, norway spruce, small leaf linden (think you guys call it lime), and or course european hornbeam. Plus many I'm sure I forgot. If you don't follow Harry Harrington on IG you're missing out. He uses almost exclusively UK native trees and he doles out tons of UK specific advice

 

[clem]

If I am only able to visit the field a handful of times a year (haven't got my driver's license yet) I wonder would it be possible to develop trunks without them dying over the summer.

If you can choose when to visit them, i would advise you to focus on visiting your trees in summer, especially during a period of drought. I would also advise you to plant your trees in the ground in the beginning of October, because you'll have this way 2 root growth period untill next summer : the roots will grow in October & November and in the following spring. If you put your trees in the ground in spring, they won't be as much rooted to resist to summer drought. It is also very important to fix the trees with sturdy stakes (to avoid the rootball move because of wind) and protect them from wild animal damage (boars, rabbit) with a fence

good luck and it would be nice of you to keep us informed of the evolution of your trees with pics

 

[BobbyLane]

If you can choose when to visit them, i would advise you to focus on visiting your trees in summer, especially during a period of drought. I would also advise you to plant your trees in the ground in the beginning of October, because you'll have this way 2 root growth period untill next summer : the roots will grow in October & November and in the following spring. If you put your trees in the ground in spring, they won't be as much rooted to resist to summer drought. It is also very important to fix the trees with sturdy stakes (to avoid the rootball move because of wind) and protect them from wild animal damage (boars, rabbit) with a fence

good luck and it would be nice of you to keep us informed of the evolution of your trees with pics

i agree with this, ive often planted trees in this period and come growth season not had to do much if any watering in at all. only if i plant in spring or summer do i water them in for establishment which takes a few weeks.

 

[leatherback]

ive often planted trees in this period and come growth season not had to do much if any watering in at all. only if i plant in spring or summer do i water them in for establishment which takes a few weeks.

I would also advise you to plant your trees in the ground in the beginning of October, because you'll have this way 2 root growth period untill next summer

Only in the first year, when the trees are seedlings, do they need water, else they might suffer (We have had 3 years where we went from winter into summer, without spring rains: Lots of losses).

I have planted out last years's seedlings in fall, as the leaves were turning to avoid that problem this year.

really? Concensus on bonsai?

 

[clem]

really? Concensus on bonsai?

it's good sign if we all agree ^^

 

[Dryad]

I would also advise you to plant your trees in the ground in the beginning of October, because you'll have this way 2 root growth period untill next summer : the roots will grow in October & November and in the following spring.

It seems this is the best solution from (shockingly) all perspectives! However, in my climate temperatures tend to plummet as early as mid-September, so there is little growth period from then on... Would I be better off planting then?

really? Concensus on bonsai?

Hurrah!

 

[leatherback]

Would I be better off planting then?

DO not stick to the calender I would say. Once you see the heat & drought of summer are over and you enter this magical fall weather, where the nights are cool, rain is aplenty and sun seems to loose its grip on the water, thats when I plant. Youc an also tell by the foliage. You notice the trees start to loose their vibrance and the first hint of fall is in the air.