JBP Learning Lesson
- Thread starter irene_b
- Start date
Chris Johnston
Omono
This may sound silly in the light of recent published information, but how do you use the chopsticks with your pines?
Chris Johnston
Omono
Irene, great job on the photos! These are so much easier to see! Thanks for hanging in there.
Okay, once more with feeling. If anyone is not clear on any directions I have given, please speak up and ask questions. That is, of course, the advantage of working in person.
Irene, if you would remove the needles circled in red on both photos, and others that fit the same mold, that is where we start. Don't go any higher on the candle. Notice how on the first photograph, the angle that the red-circled needles is much straighter out from the stem than the ones farther out. This is one indication that they are older. Your tree needs all the ones closer than this to this particular bud, so don't pull them.
On the second photo, completely remove all the stubs in red. Do the same on other needles just like this elsewhere on the tree. On this photo, though, we will treat the ones in yellow differently.
Okay, once more with feeling. If anyone is not clear on any directions I have given, please speak up and ask questions. That is, of course, the advantage of working in person.
Irene, if you would remove the needles circled in red on both photos, and others that fit the same mold, that is where we start. Don't go any higher on the candle. Notice how on the first photograph, the angle that the red-circled needles is much straighter out from the stem than the ones farther out. This is one indication that they are older. Your tree needs all the ones closer than this to this particular bud, so don't pull them.
On the second photo, completely remove all the stubs in red. Do the same on other needles just like this elsewhere on the tree. On this photo, though, we will treat the ones in yellow differently.
Attachments
define better
I am having problems opening these pics and having to save them to a temp file.
Last edited:
Chris Johnston
Omono
What I mean is, other similar needles on the other branches. For example, other branches that have older needles that stick straight out. If you want, just pull the ones I marked in red and get another shot, but you should be able to visually identify other needles like these, they are remarkably uniform from branch to branch on the same tree. So pull everything as old as the cut ones from the second photo in red, and pull everything that's about as old as the ones marked in the first photo.
Another way to know which ones to leave alone for now, is that the branch extension made from this year's growth is a light tan, while everything from last year and older should be grey bark. Remove every needle coming from grey bark unless it is a very weak branch.
Another way to know which ones to leave alone for now, is that the branch extension made from this year's growth is a light tan, while everything from last year and older should be grey bark. Remove every needle coming from grey bark unless it is a very weak branch.
Attachments
rlist
Shohin
Yeah. Me too. It is launching them in Windows viewer as opposed to opening a new tab or link...
Chris Johnston
Omono
Which pics, the ones I have added from my edit?
They open in a new tab for me, using Firefox.
They open in a new tab for me, using Firefox.
rlist
Shohin
Actually, it is only the two that are together, named attachment.
Chris Johnston
Omono
Okay, let's try this again. I'm not sure I have the technical expertise on photo software to get this done, but here goes.
The needles circled in red are old needles that should be pulled. Any needles that look like this, yellow, stiff, and close to the trunk, should be pulled all over the tree, whether or not they have been cut like this.
The ones circled in yellow are this year's needles and should be left alone until we discuss them.
Attachments
Chris Johnston
Omono
On this photo, you can see all the amazing growth of these candles from this year, as well as the huge buds for next year. If you wish to keep this growth, we will discuss how to handle these needles next. When the tree is more cleaned up, let's look at it again and decide on these branches.
Attachments
anttal63
Mame
a great thing you guys are doing irene and chris. the fact that you guys are willing to put in and teeth this process out is wonderful. the amazing thing that we are still on topic and civil is the best. i have enjoyed reading thus far. "immensely"
thanks:
thanks:
bonsaibaka
Sapling
Yes, Please continue with this.
I am following along at home with my own pine... cautiously.
Thanks Irene and Chris!
I am following along at home with my own pine... cautiously.
Thanks Irene and Chris!
For all of you who are following along with your pines please post a pic of it as well.....
Mom
Brent
Mame
Maybe I am missing the pictue here, but I would not pluck needles on a JBP that was still in its very early training stages such as these. Needle plucking has its place in the very final ramification of a finished tree, but not a tree in training to my understanding. In a tree in training, you want to get as many bud breaks as possible. Other than the buds at the nodes there are two sources of dormant buds, the ones buried deep in the bark, and the one bud between each needle pair. If you pluck the needles, then you remove the needle pair bud, but it is much easier to get this bud to break than to get deeply buried buds in the bark to break (that a lot of B's). I shorten but not remove extant needles on a tree in training (except for dead needles). You can cut them way back, even to just short stubs and preserve the buds. Thoughts?
Brent
EvergreenGardenworks.ocm
see our blog at http://BonsaiNurseryman.typepad.com
Brent
EvergreenGardenworks.ocm
see our blog at http://BonsaiNurseryman.typepad.com
Chris Johnston
Omono
Brent, it all depends on your purpose and goals for the tree. The purpose of this thread was to show one way to develop young Japanese black pines. Most enthusiasts have trees in this stage of development or a little further along. That's what I hoped to provide, a bit of direction for trees in that stage. Sometimes on older needles like this we pull them by grabbing them by the handful and stripping them off. If the tree is strong and vital, as the buds on this one would indicate, it will still back bud well.
That being said, you could absolutely cut those needles instead of pulling them. When you cut back the terminals, you will have your choice of buds to choose from. This tree is still very young for most training techniques, but, along with most beginners or frustrated just-beyond-beginners, get tired of hearing "put it in the ground for a few years." So we will work with the material that's there, and hopefully take lessons from it.
A strong healthy JBP will also pop adventitious buds if needle buds are not available. Not as many, but they will do it on wood up to almost 10 years old. However, another valid method for training is to build your trunk without worrying about inner buds at all, and grafting buds where you wish them. There are many paths to the mountain.
