Repotting big maple

sorce

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That book....this...2 periods of root growth...
Dumb as hell....
Too untrue.

One can witness them growing all the time.

Walter ..
Thanks for this..
"Growing into a better season"

S
 

clem

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Based on @Walter Pall 's post, i was wondering whether he now recommends that one only, or at least primarily, use late-summer repotting of trees (in all stages of development)).
I asked Walter if he would repot a late summer period the palmatum trees which still have a growth of the shoots, and he answered to me : """ I prefer to repot these in late spring. But maybe it works now. """
You don't read carefully, as walter said previously :p (cool it's a joke)
 
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leatherback

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It is a bit boring when people (such as myself) who are genuinely interested in learning about "hedge pruning" or "late-summer repotting" have their sincere questions met with "my trees are worth thousands of dollars", "go look at my gallery for proof" or "do you think i'm an idiot?". After all, he has essentially pioneered these methods when it comes to maple bonsai, so you would think he would welcome people who would like to adopt his approach with enthusiasm. Regardless, this is a discussion forum and people are allowed to ask questions, especially when it comes to sharing information and learning.
The trouble is that most of the bonsai crowd is very much living tradition. So innovation or alternative ideas are often met with criticism. If you get your nose bumped too often, you quickly stop thinking people mean well when asking questions.

I suppose that is what is happening here too. Whatever @Walter Pall does in types of innovation, is initially ridiculed, questioned or straighout been called stupid. In such a situation I for one would be suspicious of general questions too. A little difference in the wording may make the world of difference. After all, a forum is hard to convey meaning. And if you then have a language barrier to break..

I for one hope he stays here and shares his experience.
 
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clem

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1 - I'm asking for his recommendation (of course, he does not owe me an answer)

2 - It is a bit boring when people (such as myself) who are genuinely interested in learning about "hedge pruning" or "late-summer repotting" have their sincere questions met with "my trees are worth thousands of dollars", "go look at my gallery for proof" or "do you think i'm an idiot?".
Who is perfect, Walter has his own personnality.. I think he has had the feeling that his skills were questionned. I asked him questions later and he answered me very kindly
 
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clem

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@clem

. . . tant qu'il ne tue pas mon arbre préféré de sa collection :p
haha good french speaking. If i went to his garden and choose just one tree, i really dunno if i would choose Aurora (i guess it is the tree you prefer) there are so many fantastic trees, ;)
 
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M. Frary

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bare root a tree?
For Walter he probably only needs to bare root once. At collection or with conifers later. And only to get it into inorganic soil. He doesnt use akadama so it doesnt need total replacement. Because that stuff breaks down into a muck which will need total replacement every so often.
 
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Anthony

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The answer is probably ------ air temperature --- for Bonsai pots
Say 90 to 70 degrees F in the earth allows for root growth.
So air temperature will allow in a bonsai pot.

So check your air temperatures for months x,y, or z,
Good Day
Anthony

* Having a soil that is invulnerable to cold and roots or water
would be a big plus.
 

Saddler

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1 - I'm asking for his recommendation (of course, he does not owe me an answer)

2 - It is a bit boring when people (such as myself) who are genuinely interested in learning about "hedge pruning" or "late-summer repotting" have their sincere questions met with "my trees are worth thousands of dollars", "go look at my gallery for proof" or "do you think i'm an idiot?". After all, he has essentially pioneered these methods when it comes to maple bonsai, so you would think he would welcome people who would like to adopt his approach with enthusiasm. Regardless, this is a discussion forum and people are allowed to ask questions, especially when it comes to sharing information and learning.

To answer your (off-topic) question: i have a space heater and thermostats that I will be using to regulate the temperature in my stairwell. I can keep it anywhere from -10C to +30C all winter.
I think it would not be in his best interests for him to outright recommend anything in a forum. Let’s say he did recommend to you this technique and you tried it and failed and now you are unhappy because you think he killed your tree. That would leave him in an undesirable position.

I can’t help but feel your questions shouldn’t need to be asked if are in a position to attemp his techniques. I would bet my last dollar that Walter’s “young” trees are older and more refined then anything 99% of this forum has. The way I see it is he is providing more then enough information to those that are ready to use it. Just because I can ask questions on a forum doesn’t mean I always should. I have lots of questions about what he is doing but I can see that I will learn the answer in due time or through google. I don’t see the benefit of asking one of the worlds best questions that could be considered asinine by him.


So you have already overwintered trees with your space heater and it works? That is pretty cool. I need to figure something out in the next couple of years when I have roots on a crappy tree that can withstand an August repotting to try this method out.
 
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MichaelS

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The trouble is that most of the bonsai crowd is very much living tradition. So innovation or alternative ideas are often met with criticism. If you get your nose bumped too often, you quickly stop thinking people mean well when asking questions.

I suppose that is what is happening here too. Whatever @Walter Pall does in types of innovation,
.

There is nothing innovative about repotting deciduous trees in summer. It has been done for many decades. I have done it many times and I even have an old Japanese bonsai book which states that you can repot J maples in spring before the buds start or after the leaves have hardened.
 

0soyoung

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I need to figure something out in the next couple of years when I have roots on a crappy tree that can withstand an August repotting to try this method out.
Indeed. You just need to try it and find out.

Back in 2012 I tried to interest fellow BNutters in exploring this whole subject of repotting at some time other than 'as buds swell'. Not too surprisingly, no one took the bait.

I proceeded with a series experiments anyway (using saplings from ArborDay and on-line sellers) and reported the results in the threads
I have since disposed of the redbuds (I just didn't find them interesting enough for the space they consumed), but the rest I still have and when I repot them, I do so in the season and the same bare rooting fashion as I did in the experiments.
 

MichaelS

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hello, what is the best period to repot palmatum tree for you ?
I recently learnt that some Japanese Master (at least one) repot in Autumn, after the autumn color leaves, to avoid the spring "sap hemorragy" from the cut on branches
You cut the branches of J maples in autumn after leaf fall (straight after not a week later or even better if there are a few leaves still on the tree) There is a small widow of opportunity then when the cut branches do not bleed. If you prune in winter or spring they will bleed, sometimes a lot! This procedure is for when you are not repotting. If you cut roots, the branches will not bleed when cut. This is what your master meant.
 

MichaelS

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The reason he is doing this repotting in August is so the tree isn’t slowed down in its growth. Read more carefully! Why would spring not be the appropriate time to barefoot anymore? What has changed there?
Nothing has changed. If the buds are moving, so are the roots. The only trees I know where this is not the case is Fagus. The reason for summer repotting can be if your winters are too cold and too long, the tree can suffer if you mess with the roots. I don't have that problem here because of mild temps. Leaving all the leaves on the tree ensures very rapid root re-growth.
 

Saddler

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Nothing has changed. If the buds are moving, so are the roots. The only trees I know where this is not the case is Fagus. The reason for summer repotting can be if your winters are too cold and too long, the tree can suffer if you mess with the roots. I don't have that problem here because of mild temps. Leaving all the leaves on the tree ensures very rapid root re-growth.
I’m not understanding what you are saying. What has not changed? Repot the trees in summer if your winters are too cold? That is counter to what Walter is saying about not letting summer repotted trees have a frost in the winter. He goes on to say that they respond as if nothing happened...

The tree must get frost free over-wintering. In next spring it will start as if nothing happened.

That tells me that is the big reason for summer repotting. For me repotting in the spring always causes the tree to lose about a 1/3-1/2 season of growth where it is slow to grow while it makes up for the lost roots. This sounds like it alleviates that problem.

I’m not sure what the buds moving has to do with this particular point though. Could you please explain?
 

clem

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You cut the branches of J maples in autumn after leaf fall (straight after not a week later or even better if there are a few leaves still on the tree) There is a small widow of opportunity then when the cut branches do not bleed. If you prune in winter or spring they will bleed, sometimes a lot! This procedure is for when you are not repotting. If you cut roots, the branches will not bleed when cut. This is what your master meant.
I did that last year : result : i had no sap bleeding, but a sap withdraw.. so i prefer to cut the branches in summer because i have no sap issue, and new buds emerge quickly ;)
 

sorce

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Thinking about digging up my in ground 925 Freemani maple today...since I have to before May. And that is 80% likely too early here. 40-90% on a leap year.

Noting it has been "hedge pruned" this year..

Hmmm...

There must be a correlation between MANY Auxin producing tips...generating many root tips?

Where Only a couple large branches will almost surely result in a lopsided Nebari development, or uneven growth..which is what happened to my ...soon to be untimecapsuled elm.

S
 

BobbyLane

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What is the soil mix used for that maple? I really like the black coloring.

this question was already answered on page one. most of this info can be found on his blog too, as someone pointed out on the other maple thread. its a bit tedious sifting through all the blog posts and also the comments, but if you want to learn.....
 
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