Walmart grafted maple question

[RNbonsai]

found this tree today on severe discount. The grated on tree is lace leaf maple. The bottom part of the tree has leafs coming out below the graft. I'm wondering if I can just chop off the grafted part? Also, what type of maple is the root stock? I searched and think it's some type of Japanese maple maybe? Was hoping for some id help.
Thanks

Photos are full tree, then above the graft leaf, then graft and branch below it, then below the graft leaf.

 

[Soldano666]

This is how most of my maples are started. Ideally chopping it a few weeks ago was best, however with new growth already under the graft..... do it. Then quickly smear some Elmer's glue on the cut. It will help with the bleeding. The sooner the glue is put on and dried the faster the SAP loss is stopped. Don't be too concerned with the coarse growth and large leafs you may get, they will be much smaller next season, just feed it and let it grow .. Im currently waiting for the seasonal Lowes sale, I've already scoped out all the trunks i want.
I'll snag some pics tomorrow if I remember and show you the leafs and some progress shots. I've had slight variances in leaf shape and color but I'd be willing to bet all the root stock is pretty close to the same. It's typically a hardier tree then the grafted on scion.

 

[RNbonsai]

What has been the rootstock of yours?

 

[Soldano666]

Acer palmatum. Nice small leaves too.. well the second season. After the cut it will be coarse and prob have large leaves but don't sweat it

 

[RNbonsai]

Awesome, that's what I was hoping. And even if they don't have leaves below the graft you can still just trunk chop it right? I've wondered before but never tried

 

[Soldano666]

Yes but early to mid July is best for longer recovery left in the season. a bare trunk has to wake up dormant buds and turn them into new branches. However if the growth below the graft is already bumping recovery will start immediately. Soooooooo do it now and cut to this pair of leaves and keep that as the new leader.

 

[Soldano666]

You can also heavily prune the top and chances are it will encourage new growth below the graft, and remove the top next spring once it gets growing. I save that technique for larger more expensive mapes. This one is so young it'd be tough to slow it down I think. I'd go out and chop first thing in the morn. I bet you get 2 foot long whips buy the end of summer.

 

[RNbonsai]

Well I broke those two leaves off when I cut it, but hopefully she grows strong.

 

[Soldano666]

Oh no ha-ha I'm sure you'll be fine. Since that blooper happened id go ahead and cut further down. It'll help give your trunk some movement down the road and also help you from wanting to trunk chop later in life cause its too straight and no taper. This option gives you 2 areas (the bumps) where you should get buds. Perfect spots for a first branch and a new leader, I'd bet you got some trunk under that soil line too. I'll post up some pics of what I've done and where I'm at after only 2 or 3 seasons for ya tomorrow.

 

[Soldano666]

What I would do is scower home depot, lowes, and other walmaaahts around your areas and surrounding towns and get a bunch to experiment on. Esp if they are on sale. Wait.!!! That is what I do all the time.

 

[Soldano666]

I do it with crabapples from box stores too. This guy was cut right thru the graft this spring before bud break. And growing great I don't think I could have got growth in any better of spots two popped right at my chop

 

[RNbonsai]

Nice! Yea, after I broke it I just glued and walked away haha. I'll look at it tommorrow and likely follow your advice to chop lower. I think I'll wait till next season to dig down for roots as there really isn't any reason to at this point right? And now that I know this a viable option I will definitely be trying this more.
I've seen tons of trees that I've wondered about doing this too and for some reason always doubted it. Glad to hear you've had it work well. To me the root stock tree is more valuable than the grafted on one anyways

 

[Soldano666]

. I think I'll wait till next season to dig down for roots as there really isn't any reason to at this point right?
To me the root stock tree is more valuable than the grafted on one anyways

Correct no need to mess with roots or even the surface ones. And secondly there's tons to go get, malus, prunus, pyrus, Japanese maples, I see linden trees with a grafts occasionaly and snatch em up too. Especially in the fall... 75% off

 

[RNbonsai]

I'm surprised I had not seen this mentioned here before- it's like a totally new opportunity

 

[Soldano666]

I'm surprised I had not seen this mentioned here before- it's like a totally new opportunity

Agreed I don't recall ever seeing anything online that walks thru the process or options of dealing with nursery grafted deciduous material. If you find large enough material I feel like there's tons of potential. I snagged these this morning. The fist one was chopped only a few weeks ago at the graft some of the growth below the graft was already started. I've since picked a couple branches and wired em out, and cut the rest back as an experiment to watch results. you can also see the leaf size is not ideal but pic two shows what happens the second season. Tree #2 was cut back last summer and allowed to grow freely the rest of the summer, I repotted and trimmed all but what I wanted to keep and have left it to grow wild all summer notice the leaf size and color have changed tree #3 was the same process as #2 but I cut it back again hard to see what happens kind of deal. I expect a ton of new buds and branches but also expect growth to slow down the remainder of the season not putting on much girth but I'm basically just making trunks right now and monitoring progress so I know what to do with the bigger ones I'm waiting for to go on sale then I have this guy, the graft was high so when I chopped 2seasons ago I chopped a little high making it available to airlayer. Last summer it grew wild and pushed tons of growth, never pruned, this season same deal except I diddnt get as much growth but everything is getting thicker, leaves reduced somemore and I stared the airlayer.

 

[sorce]

high

First....I love that you are finding use of these trees, I look for them myself.

But...after Arme suggested buying oildry through a mechanic for a lesser cost.....

I wonder if you shouldn't try to contact a direct source of only the rootstock.

No Graft $, no yuppie cultivar $, no retail markup $
=

You with a lot more dope shit to work on!

Sorce

 

[Soldano666]

I wonder if you shouldn't try to contact a direct source of only the rootstock

Sorce

I will look a little further into that @sorce I did find a few thru eBay couple years back but got over charged quit a bit and found the nursery stuff quite a bit cheaper as long as it was on clearance, that sucks sometimes tho because you have to wait untill the following year to work on it since the biggest clearance is in the fall. Untill then..... High as f

 

[M. Frary]

You should find a regular nursery and ask to see misfit island. They all have them. It's where trees that got broken limbs or some other defect keeps it from being sold. It's usually out back.

 

[petegreg]

'Sango-kaku' or Coral bark cultivar of Acer palmatum. Nice.

 

[Soldano666]

'Sango-kaku' or Coral bark cultivar of Acer palmatum. Nice.

Is that what you implying I might have here Pete? If so that's great