Yet another Satsuki into the collection!

[Glaucus]

Now I'm not sure on what this azalea actually is. @Glaucus, you mentioned it could be a North Tisbury azalea, maybe it's easier to identify now with the flowers? I really didn't expect anything special from this azalea as I thought it'd simply be plain pink flowers, but it turns out it actually has some really lovely colours. It doesn't seem to be the most vigorous grower but it was repotted from quite a tight pot with a compacted rootball this year, so maybe I'll just have to give it time.

That's defenitelty bit a North Tisbury. Seems to be some kind of satsuki, not sure which. 6 petals isn't super common so it may be a clue. Seems similar to Asuka and sports, but it is not quite right. Flowers too small, etc.

This one is 'Hanatsuzuri' I'm pretty sure. While I did think that the flowers would be lovely when I first picked this cultivar up, I never thought they'd be this amazing. The first flower I saw was the top left, pure red flower. It's a lot more of a deeper red than the picture shows, and it was absolutely striking. The flowers are quite big and there seems to be many different patterns, with the number of petals varying too. I think this cultivar may definitely be one of my favourites.

Hanatsuzuri is very impressive. Though the cultivar could still be improved if the flowers were slightly larger and the petals were thicker and durable like say Haru no Sono. And maybe the red a bit darker.
Not the perfect dream azalea quite yet. Yours seems to be heavily on the red side, so be wary of that. You may want to 'replace' some of those branches with new ones.
Once you also get the fine dusting on the white flower on your tree, you'd be really impressed.

Cover from both rain and direct sunlight will do a lot for the durability of the flowers. The flowers on my cuttings inside my polytunnel are excellent. While those out in the garden in sunny spots fade very quickly, or bleach, or get petal blight.
A shade setup for summers definitely is worth it. When it is 30C in and sun shines on their pots all day, they aren't happy about that. They do much better if their roots are kept cool. But they do like the humid warm damp weather, which we rarely have here in W Europe (but I have right now with finally a thunderstorm).
Also, do I get props for IDing correctly your plants when they were out of flower and you took off the label?

/humblebrag

 

[Glaucus]

That's defenitelty bit a North Tisbury.

I meant to type 'definitely NOT'.

 

[keyfen06]

Hanatsuzuri is very impressive. Though the cultivar could still be improved if the flowers were slightly larger and the petals were thicker and durable like say Haru no Sono. And maybe the red a bit darker.
Not the perfect dream azalea quite yet. Yours seems to be heavily on the red side, so be wary of that. You may want to 'replace' some of those branches with new ones.

So to replace these branches, I should just prune them off right? Then, just let new branches develop and hope that they're not red?

Also, do I propagate from the white flowers with small dusting / stripes for full range of colours on the cutting?

Once you also get the fine dusting on the white flower on your tree, you'd be really impressed.

I had a brief look over them since a few more flowers opened, and some of them have a fine dusting. I can't believe how much variation there is on the flowers, I've never seen anything like it with my other cultivars.

I meant to type 'definitely NOT'.

North Tisbury azaleas are hybrids of R. nakaharae right? If I remember correctly, R. nakaharae like to creep. I wonder if crossing it with a satsuki would result in a nice, creeping cultivar that could be used for a cascade style tree?

Also, do I get props for IDing correctly your plants when they were out of flower and you took off the label?

/humblebrag

I would expect no less from the leader of a satsuki cult. Give me another 10 years and maybe I'll be able to do it too.

/thelabelcollectionhasgrown

 

[Glaucus]

So to replace these branches, I should just prune them off right? Then, just let new branches develop and hope that they're not red?

To replace them, yes. But let's backtrack a bit first. Right now, you only need to make a mental note of branches that are mostly red. It seems that the primary branch on your Hanatsuzuri is all or mostly red, correct? I can't properly and accurately judge from the picture. Having an all-red primary branch could be perfectly fine. That's a matter of taste. But you might want to decide to have a main/primary branch that shows more variation. It is a matter of balance, right. Usually, it pays off to have a minor branch that is colour dominant ie that wouldn't be the proper branch to propagate cuttings from. Having too little colour is also not good.
But say in 5 years time, your primary branch if all solid red, and you have two other minor branches higher up that also are becoming colour-dominant, losing variation. Then you may want to nurture a new primary branch that does have colour variation.
The first step would be slowing down your all-red primary branch. Then waiting for some new white branches to grow. When a satsuki is healthy, it will often backbud without pruning from bald sun-exposed areas,
So you'd get some new branches automatically. And you get those grow while keeping the all-red branch in a status quo.
Then, when your new branches are larger, you can prune back the all-red branch. Eventually, you can completely remove it.

So mostly it is about directing energy into the parts of the tree that show the good flower variations, by slowing down the areas that do not.

Also, do I propagate from the white flowers with small dusting / stripes for full range of colours on the cutting?

I believe so. I wonder myself if the dusting pattern can be lost independently of the normal red variegation. What I mean is, if you propagate from a branch that shows the white flowers dusted with red spots, do you get a cutting that is also inclined to show some flowers with dusting? And contrary, if you propagate from a branch that doesn't seem willing to show the red spot dusting, does that mean this dusting pattern will very rarely or even never show up?
I suspect it is not binary at all. So if you propagate from a branch that has good variation and that easily show many patterned flowers, the plants produced from those cuttings will more likely be similar.
However, if you propagate from a branch that is mostly all-white flowers that are shy to show variegation, you may get plants that are shy to throw patterns as well.
So that would be the opposite side of the coin. You want to avoid all-red flowers. But you also want to avoid all-white flowers.

I had a brief look over them since a few more flowers opened, and some of them have a fine dusting. I can't believe how much variation there is on the flowers, I've never seen anything like it with my other cultivars.

It is the power of a flower display cultivar in combination with an individual plant that is good at throwing the full range of patterns.
There are quite some more cultivar that have the potential to show a ton of variation. But you don't just need the cultivar. You need a good version of that cultivar. And a tiny bit of luck.
There is some discussion about the effect of fertilizer. But that seems more related to white centers than to stripes and sectors. Different types of variagation likely have different mechanism,s which may have different triggers or environmental factors that slightly influence them. But so far to me it seems that if you have a good version of a cultivar, you get some good results. It is not like you use magic sauce os special nutrients or techniques to somehow trigger flower variegation.

North Tisbury azaleas are hybrids of R. nakaharae right? If I remember correctly, R. nakaharae like to creep. I wonder if crossing it with a satsuki would result in a nice, creeping cultivar that could be used for a cascade style tree?

There is a variety called 'Pink Cascade' that was developed using R.nakaharae to be suitable for growing from hanging baskets. And thus to cascade from it. I am not completely sure if this worked as intended.
But for bonsai, you can always use wire. Not sure if a cascading or creeping plant habit produces a better cascade bonsai. But indeed, R.nakaharae hybrids creep, often staying below 20cm even after 20 years. They just cover more space, growing horizontally.

 

[keyfen06]

To replace them, yes. But let's backtrack a bit first. Right now, you only need to make a mental note of branches that are mostly red. It seems that the primary branch on your Hanatsuzuri is all or mostly red, correct? I can't properly and accurately judge from the picture.

As you can see, the primary bench is mostly red. I think there's one or two white flowers near the back. I think I quite like how it is at the moment, but maybe I'll decide against it in a while. I think I'll definitely try and get some branches that have colour variation above the primary branch, as red does seem to be overwhelming the tree at this point.

Also, in terms of lichen - is it harmful for plants? I've read that they don't harm plants and they take nutrients from the surrounding air and rainfall but I wanted to check. There's quite a bit of it growing on the soil of a lot of my trees, and I'm guessing that overwatering may promote the growth of lichen. I haven't seen any negative effects in the foliage to indicate that I do overwater my plants, but just in case I have started to slow down on the watering.

I believe so. I wonder myself if the dusting pattern can be lost independently of the normal red variegation. What I mean is, if you propagate from a branch that shows the white flowers dusted with red spots, do you get a cutting that is also inclined to show some flowers with dusting? And contrary, if you propagate from a branch that doesn't seem willing to show the red spot dusting, does that mean this dusting pattern will very rarely or even never show up?

I think I have a few flowers of Shiroihanakazari or Gin-no-Suzu which are showing the dusting pattern, so I will likely propagate from these and we can see the results in a year or two (unless you already have started to try this already!)

I suspect it is not binary at all. So if you propagate from a branch that has good variation and that easily show many patterned flowers, the plants produced from those cuttings will more likely be similar.
However, if you propagate from a branch that is mostly all-white flowers that are shy to show variegation, you may get plants that are shy to throw patterns as well.
So that would be the opposite side of the coin. You want to avoid all-red flowers. But you also want to avoid all-white flowers.

I'm not sure if you have Alexander Kennedy's book, 'Satsuki', but this is a diagram that I found in there which may be of some use. He also mentions that with shibori blooms, the shoots growing on the side of the colour will typically only produce coloured flowers as cuttings, while shoots growing on the side of the white will produce all the patterns. There is also the document in the American Azalea Society magazine which is all about propagating satsuki from cuttings. I don't know if there's anything in Rick Garcia's book about this, but it looks so detailed that I may pick it up soon. Unfortunately, Callahan's book is around £150 here compared to £45 for Garcia's.

There is a variety called 'Pink Cascade' that was developed using R.nakaharae to be suitable for growing from hanging baskets. And thus to cascade from it. I am not completely sure if this worked as intended.
But for bonsai, you can always use wire. Not sure if a cascading or creeping plant habit produces a better cascade bonsai. But indeed, R.nakaharae hybrids creep, often staying below 20cm even after 20 years. They just cover more space, growing horizontally.

I think it might be nice to have a tree that has the satsuki variation of flowers with a creeping plant habit, and just let it grow in a hanging plant basket or in a massive cascade pot. There was one in the Satsuki Azalea Bonsai UK Facebook group a few days ago which really struck me. I guess it would be a lot easier to just wire the plant down into a cascade style and let it grow like that instead of trying to breed one for years.

Also, on the topic of breeding, I made my final crosses for this year:


Unk. x Hanatsuzuri. This is what the unknown flowers look like:


The petals seem quite thick and the flower is quite big which was nice. I'm not sure if it's a triploid or not, because I'm quite unsure what constitutes as thick petals. There's a lovely pale pink stripe too.


Shinnyo-no-Tsuki x Hanatsuzuri

I quite like the white centers on Shinnyo-no-Tsuki and the growth habit is quite nice.


Unk 2. x Hanatsuzuri. This is what the unknown flowers look like:



I really like the growth habit and the flowers on this one. Also, if you couldn't tell already, I've seemed to lean quite heavily towards using Hanatsuzuri as a pollen parent. It's a great pollen parent, but I also really like the flowers on it. Although I'm not sure if I'll see a lot of Hanatsuzuri DNA in a lot of the crosses.


Dai-seiko x Shien

I really wanted to use Dai-seiko in at least one cross because of how beautiful the flower is and the growth habit / foliage, so I did. Shien and Dai-seiko aren't very similar either, so maybe I can get some interesting results hopefully. I just hope the leaves don't resemble Shien as much, because they may be my least favourite foliage of all of my azaleas.


Dai-seiko x Gin-no-Suzu (or Shiroihanakazari)

I remembered yesterday which pollen parent I used, but I've managed to forget again without noting it down. I'm 70% sure it's Shiroihanakazari, but I'll have to confirm again tomorrow. Anyway, these two cultivars seem to be a bit of a wide cross so I thought I'd experiment with them.

Then there is the Kinsai x Senbazuru cross I did too, but I have already mentioned that one. I think the ovule may be swelling a bit on Kinsai too, which is good.


There isn't much reasoning I used behind my crosses, mostly just thinking about the growth habit, foliage and flowers of the cultivars I used without thinking too much what the seedlings would look like. I think this year's crosses may just be more of a trial run to experiment with what I get and train myself in raising the seedlings. I am also aware that with six crosses, I may end up with hundreds of seedlings if the germination rates are good and I don't end up killing them. That is a daunting thought after transplanting 30 or so cherry tree and quince seedlings today.

Also, seeing the pollen strings is one of the most satisfying things I've encountered in bonsai. It might just be equal or less to the thrill of striking cuttings.

 

[Glaucus]

View attachment 495615View attachment 495616

As you can see, the primary bench is mostly red. I think there's one or two white flowers near the back. I think I quite like how it is at the moment, but maybe I'll decide against it in a while. I think I'll definitely try and get some branches that have colour variation above the primary branch, as red does seem to be overwhelming the tree at this point.

Is is very nice right now, because it is so rich in colour. But indeed long term it might be a problem. Just something to watch. There may also be a competing interest between true bonsai design and flower variation.
So you have two different reasons to prune or not prune. And then you also have the 3 to 4 year repotting schedule which may interfere with your plans.

Also, in terms of lichen - is it harmful for plants? I've read that they don't harm plants and they take nutrients from the surrounding air and rainfall but I wanted to check. There's quite a bit of it growing on the soil of a lot of my trees, and I'm guessing that overwatering may promote the growth of lichen. I haven't seen any negative effects in the foliage to indicate that I do overwater my plants, but just in case I have started to slow down on the watering.

I have heard some people say they do also send enzymes into their environment (so into the azalea bark) and draw nutrients or sugars from the azalea. Not sure if that's true.
I often have both moss and lichens grow on branches. One can brush them off, power wash them off, use vinegar to get them off, or even use a herbicide that only attacks lower plants (mosses and lichens).
I need to try that last method myself.
However, you have liverworts on the kanuma. Those are not the lichens, I think you realize. But they are also a sign of high humidity. It was very sunny here the last couple of weeks. So now with more cooler clowdy weather, it is time to let the satsuki (safely) dry out a bit more. The liverworts indicate it is generally a bit too wet. I think the main issue with overwatering is that you wash all your nutrients out of the kanuma. And if you don't provide new nutrients, you risk getting chlorosis.

I think I have a few flowers of Shiroihanakazari or Gin-no-Suzu which are showing the dusting pattern, so I will likely propagate from these and we can see the results in a year or two (unless you already have started to try this already!)

View attachment 495619
I'm not sure if you have Alexander Kennedy's book, 'Satsuki', but this is a diagram that I found in there which may be of some use. He also mentions that with shibori blooms, the shoots growing on the side of the colour will typically only produce coloured flowers as cuttings, while shoots growing on the side of the white will produce all the patterns. There is also the document in the American Azalea Society magazine which is all about propagating satsuki from cuttings. I don't know if there's anything in Rick Garcia's book about this, but it looks so detailed that I may pick it up soon. Unfortunately, Callahan's book is around £150 here compared to £45 for Garcia's.

I don't have Kennedy's book but I do have Callahan. These books all show the same diagrams, which is correct. Here is one from a Japanese book:



And my own diagram:




These diagrams are perfect for taking cuttings. You will have to check the flowers on cuttings anyway, the first time to flower, to make sure they come true to cultivar.

However, there seems to be a higher levle of understanding. Many flower seem to work in parallel, ie independently. For example on Haru no Sono, the fukurin pattern seems to appear interdependently of the darker coloured stripes and sectors. Which is why a flower can have a fukurin pattern AND darker sectors or stripes.
Similarly, a flower can have both white centers/sokojiro AND fukurin, creating the janome pattern.

Which is why I am wondering if other patterns like dusting/mijin shibori pattern also acts independently of normal shibori and/or fukurin and sokojiro.
Hanatsuzuri is very good because it has many patterns. But it does lack white centers/sokojiro and tamafu. The holy grail of flower display cultivar would be something with large flowers, both red and purple, fukurin, sokojiro, tamafu, mijin shibori or similar, and the usual shibori variagation, all that combined with large flowers and thick petals that improve flower durability and longevity

(posting because interface seems laggy).

I think it might be nice to have a tree that has the satsuki variation of flowers with a creeping plant habit, and just let it grow in a hanging plant basket or in a massive cascade pot. There was one in the Satsuki Azalea Bonsai UK Facebook group a few days ago which really struck me. I guess it would be a lot easier to just wire the plant down into a cascade style and let it grow like that instead of trying to breed one for years.

Also, on the topic of breeding, I made my final crosses for this year:


Unk. x Hanatsuzuri. This is what the unknown flowers look like:
View attachment 495620View attachment 495622

The petals seem quite thick and the flower is quite big which was nice. I'm not sure if it's a triploid or not, because I'm quite unsure what constitutes as thick petals. There's a lovely pale pink stripe too.


Shinnyo-no-Tsuki x Hanatsuzuri

I quite like the white centers on Shinnyo-no-Tsuki and the growth habit is quite nice.


Unk 2. x Hanatsuzuri. This is what the unknown flowers look like:

View attachment 495623

I really like the growth habit and the flowers on this one. Also, if you couldn't tell already, I've seemed to lean quite heavily towards using Hanatsuzuri as a pollen parent. It's a great pollen parent, but I also really like the flowers on it. Although I'm not sure if I'll see a lot of Hanatsuzuri DNA in a lot of the crosses.


Dai-seiko x Shien

I really wanted to use Dai-seiko in at least one cross because of how beautiful the flower is and the growth habit / foliage, so I did. Shien and Dai-seiko aren't very similar either, so maybe I can get some interesting results hopefully. I just hope the leaves don't resemble Shien as much, because they may be my least favourite foliage of all of my azaleas.


Dai-seiko x Gin-no-Suzu (or Shiroihanakazari)

I remembered yesterday which pollen parent I used, but I've managed to forget again without noting it down. I'm 70% sure it's Shiroihanakazari, but I'll have to confirm again tomorrow. Anyway, these two cultivars seem to be a bit of a wide cross so I thought I'd experiment with them.

Then there is the Kinsai x Senbazuru cross I did too, but I have already mentioned that one. I think the ovule may be swelling a bit on Kinsai too, which is good.


There isn't much reasoning I used behind my crosses, mostly just thinking about the growth habit, foliage and flowers of the cultivars I used without thinking too much what the seedlings would look like. I think this year's crosses may just be more of a trial run to experiment with what I get and train myself in raising the seedlings. I am also aware that with six crosses, I may end up with hundreds of seedlings if the germination rates are good and I don't end up killing them. That is a daunting thought after transplanting 30 or so cherry tree and quince seedlings today.

Also, seeing the pollen strings is one of the most satisfying things I've encountered in bonsai. It might just be equal or less to the thrill of striking cuttings.

 

[Glaucus]

I think it might be nice to have a tree that has the satsuki variation of flowers with a creeping plant habit, and just let it grow in a hanging plant basket or in a massive cascade pot. There was one in the Satsuki Azalea Bonsai UK Facebook group a few days ago which really struck me. I guess it would be a lot easier to just wire the plant down into a cascade style and let it grow like that instead of trying to breed one for years.

Well, I have the stock plants already for this type of breeding. However, if with 'satsuki variation of flower' you mean variegated flowers, it seems that diluting R.nakaharae to 12.5% reduces the true creeping habit.
I used 'Alexander' (R.nakaharae x 'Kinsai') as my main source of R.nakaharae blood. But I have been thinging if one really wanted to move this further, one would use something like 'Pink Pillow' or 'Late Love' and cross it with one of my seedling selections, Ae22 or We1 maybe. Or use 'Mount of Seven Stars' and cross it with a satsuki one likes, say Asuka or Hanatsuzuri or Juko/Byakuren/Karenko or maybe Kangiten/Kisshoten. And cross that back to Ae22 or We1 that I obtained.
I decided not to move forward that way. But I pushed the boundary forward that way at least a bit. For a better satsuki x R.nakaharae hybridization, one needs to use a R.nakaharae hybrid different from 'Alexander' and cross it with a ideally a white satsuki. And cross that with my Ae22 or We1. Based on my results, I believe when crossing Ae22 with say 'Late Love', 25% of the seedlings will be white, and some of them may show variegation on that white background. With We1, I believe 25% will also be white. But I cannot guarantee they will be variegated.
I believe that 'Mount Seven Star' is the only 100% R.nakaharae cultivar available around Europe. But it is hard to find. It has been around and I kinda almost ordered it from a Danish nursery, but then didn't.
I am raising some Ae22 x We1 (so 'Alexander' x 'Hekisui' X 'Wintergreen' x 'Hekisui' seedlings, so those would also be high in R.nakaharae genes, and mix up the 'Alexander' and 'Wintergreen' genes, while maybe also bringing out 'Hekisui' style flowers. But they may flower for the first time in 2025. If you want to delve deeper into this, I recommend getting 'Mount Seven Star', crossing it with a white and red flowering satsuki, and then maybe crossing your best form to my best form.

The article on cascading azaleas from hanging baskets is here:

JARS v40n1 - A Basket Case

There isn't much reasoning I used behind my crosses, mostly just thinking about the growth habit, foliage and flowers of the cultivars I used without thinking too much what the seedlings would look like. I think this year's crosses may just be more of a trial run to experiment with what I get and train myself in raising the seedlings. I am also aware that with six crosses, I may end up with hundreds of seedlings if the germination rates are good and I don't end up killing them. That is a daunting thought after transplanting 30 or so cherry tree and quince seedlings today.

Yup, fruits should be swelling right now. It will be clear which flowers are pollinated and fruiting and which ones are shriveling up. You may be 1 or 2 weeks behind me, though.
I have not had supergood results this year transferring my smaller seedlings outdoors. A bunch of them are huge, but most of them are kind of stagnating. First the night temperatures were too low, and that caused dormancy. But after that, it was too dry, hot and sunny. And they also stressed a bit. Not completely ideal, but the strong ones will pull through. Eventually, they will take off and grow like weeds.
Transplating hundreds of seedlings is a bit of work. But when you realize you first paid a ton of money for those rare satsuki imported all the way from Japan, but now you just grow hundreds of them for the cost of a bag of peat, it is pretty good.

Also, seeing the pollen strings is one of the most satisfying things I've encountered in bonsai. It might just be equal or less to the thrill of striking cuttings.

If a ton of pollen comes out and you can completely cover up the stigma a couple of times, that's pretty nice. Not sure if it is the most exciting thing in bonsai, though.

 

[keyfen06]

However, you have liverworts on the kanuma. Those are not the lichens, I think you realize. But they are also a sign of high humidity. It was very sunny here the last couple of weeks. So now with more cooler clowdy weather, it is time to let the satsuki (safely) dry out a bit more. The liverworts indicate it is generally a bit too wet. I think the main issue with overwatering is that you wash all your nutrients out of the kanuma. And if you don't provide new nutrients, you risk getting chlorosis.

It turns out I did mix up liverworts and lichens. I have slowed down my watering on the azaleas now, especially since it's starting to get a bit more cloudy and cooler (19-22C) compared to the 28-29C days we've had.

Well, I have the stock plants already for this type of breeding. However, if with 'satsuki variation of flower' you mean variegated flowers, it seems that diluting R.nakaharae to 12.5% reduces the true creeping habit.
I used 'Alexander' (R.nakaharae x 'Kinsai') as my main source of R.nakaharae blood. But I have been thinging if one really wanted to move this further, one would use something like 'Pink Pillow' or 'Late Love' and cross it with one of my seedling selections, Ae22 or We1 maybe. Or use 'Mount of Seven Stars' and cross it with a satsuki one likes, say Asuka or Hanatsuzuri or Juko/Byakuren/Karenko or maybe Kangiten/Kisshoten. And cross that back to Ae22 or We1 that I obtained.
I decided not to move forward that way. But I pushed the boundary forward that way at least a bit. For a better satsuki x R.nakaharae hybridization, one needs to use a R.nakaharae hybrid different from 'Alexander' and cross it with a ideally a white satsuki. And cross that with my Ae22 or We1. Based on my results, I believe when crossing Ae22 with say 'Late Love', 25% of the seedlings will be white, and some of them may show variegation on that white background. With We1, I believe 25% will also be white. But I cannot guarantee they will be variegated.
I believe that 'Mount Seven Star' is the only 100% R.nakaharae cultivar available around Europe. But it is hard to find. It has been around and I kinda almost ordered it from a Danish nursery, but then didn't.
I am raising some Ae22 x We1 (so 'Alexander' x 'Hekisui' X 'Wintergreen' x 'Hekisui' seedlings, so those would also be high in R.nakaharae genes, and mix up the 'Alexander' and 'Wintergreen' genes, while maybe also bringing out 'Hekisui' style flowers. But they may flower for the first time in 2025. If you want to delve deeper into this, I recommend getting 'Mount Seven Star', crossing it with a white and red flowering satsuki, and then maybe crossing your best form to my best form.

Luckily, there is one nursery here that sells 'Mount Seven Star' for a very good price considering I can't find it anywhere else (£14.95). It's also where I got the Glenn Dale 'Surprise' and the two Kaempferi 'White Lady' and 'Orange Beauty' from. I will likely pick it up next year and cross it with both an Asuka and Hanatsuzuri like you mention, then in a few years time make a cross to your best form when possible.

Yup, fruits should be swelling right now. It will be clear which flowers are pollinated and fruiting and which ones are shriveling up. You may be 1 or 2 weeks behind me, though.
I have not had supergood results this year transferring my smaller seedlings outdoors. A bunch of them are huge, but most of them are kind of stagnating. First the night temperatures were too low, and that caused dormancy. But after that, it was too dry, hot and sunny. And they also stressed a bit. Not completely ideal, but the strong ones will pull through. Eventually, they will take off and grow like weeds.

What are the night temperatures like over there now? The coldest night temperatures we're getting are mostly 12C. I am slightly north though, so I can't imagine what the heat is like down in southern England.

Also, out of pure curiosity, have you ever tried letting a seedling or cutting just grow as high as possible like in a whip form? I'm guessing that the end result would probably be quite a taperless long stick, but I'm curious just how tall a shrub can get. I wonder if the height would also vary massively from cultivar to cultivar depending on the growth habit.