Colanders and mesh; hold your roots!

[Anthony]

Clicio,

we use a colander in the ground [ growing trough ] because it allows the
roots to escape and create trunks of 8 to 10 cm, in as little as 6 months [ see Chlorophora t.]
and can add in 6 branches.

When you remove the colander from the the ground growing. The colander allows the
tree to regenerate fine feeder roots in a month or two.

Then you can cut off the thick roots safely.

Next stage is branch refinement in [ in our case we use over size plastic bonsai pot from Dallas Bonsai ]

There is no use for a colander in the --- Refinement Stage.
Images will follow.

@MrFancyPlants ,

the explanation is in Bonsai Today - the double colander encourages the J.B.pine to grow coarse
surface roots, as does the triple.
The idea is to have a pine with surface roots.

Will not work on a hard wood pine [ eg. Caribbean/Honduran lumber pine ] but will
work on a softwood - J.B.pine.
Good Day
Anthony

Colander dug up and tree left to recover fine feeder roots [ Celtis l - Hackberry ]



Same tree in a bonsai pot for refinement of branches may take 5 years.

[ Celtis l. - Hackberry - we use a fridge to simulate winter ]



Chlorophora t. [ Clicio grows in your country, try it ]

This was grown as a supply for cuttings in another part of Trinidad [ another Bonsai Group ]
Took around 6 months of ground growing, and then after being dug up, left to regenerate
the fine feeder roots.

 

[Clicio]

[ Celtis l. - Hackberry - we use a fridge to simulate winter ]

@Anthony I know it's off topic, but could you explain how do you use the fridge? We have some problems with wintering trees here, so I am interested, specially for pines.
No lights?
No air circulation?
No humidity?

 

[sorce]

@miker is a fridge guru too IMO.

Sorce

 

[Anthony]

Clicio,

experience is limited to deciduous trees.

Temperature is limited to the lowest setting, around vegetable crisper.
3rd week in January until April 1st.
6 weeks is the shortest time needed.

Check weekly for drying out, which is fridge death.

No light needed.

Have tested on 2 junipers - no light needed.

We can grow anything that can handle a top temperature of 33 deg.C for
less than half and hour.
But some will have to grown in bright light or dappled light or morning sun before
10 a.m and evening sun after 3 p.m.

Now testing Celtis c. to see if it even needs the fridge.
One guy has had one down here for over 10 years, goes self dormant.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Anthony]

@Clicio ,

https://modernfarmer.com/2013/07/straw-bale-gardening/

From Aubonsai -

http://www.ausbonsai.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=14986&start=150

see last post. Melbrakstone March 30th.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Clicio]

From Aubonsai -
http://www.ausbonsai.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=14986&start=150

Very interesting @Anthony
I have no idea of where can I buy the straw bales here but I will search for them.
Thanks!

 

[Clicio]

Very interesting @Anthony
I have no idea of where can I buy the straw bales here but I will search for them.
Thanks!

@Anthony Have you seen this article?
https://thegrownetwork.com/hidden-dangers-straw-bale-gardening/

 

[Anthony]

Hello @Clicio ,

yes, that would be good commonsense.

Been a follower of organic gardening plus science with commonsense.

We use no pesticides here and the compost does most of the work
along side with what is known as ----- companion planting ------ for
example - tomatoes and basil.

Also compost has to used at a rate of less than or equal to 7 parts inorganic
to 3 parts compost. We can use coarse in the garden and sifted for the
bonsai
To much compost and too much water retention.

Thanks for posting the article.
Good Day
Anthony

 

[Adair M]

Clicio,

we use a colander in the ground [ growing trough ] because it allows the
roots to escape and create trunks of 8 to 10 cm, in as little as 6 months [ see Chlorophora t.]
and can add in 6 branches.

When you remove the colander from the the ground growing. The colander allows the
tree to regenerate fine feeder roots in a month or two.

Then you can cut off the thick roots safely.

Next stage is branch refinement in [ in our case we use over size plastic bonsai pot from Dallas Bonsai ]

There is no use for a colander in the --- Refinement Stage.
Images will follow.

@MrFancyPlants ,

the explanation is in Bonsai Today - the double colander encourages the J.B.pine to grow coarse
surface roots, as does the triple.
The idea is to have a pine with surface roots.

Will not work on a hard wood pine [ eg. Caribbean/Honduran lumber pine ] but will
work on a softwood - J.B.pine.
Good Day
Anthony

Colander dug up and tree left to recover fine feeder roots [ Celtis l - Hackberry ]

View attachment 185102

Same tree in a bonsai pot for refinement of branches may take 5 years.

[ Celtis l. - Hackberry - we use a fridge to simulate winter ]

View attachment 185103

Chlorophora t. [ Clicio grows in your country, try it ]

This was grown as a supply for cuttings in another part of Trinidad [ another Bonsai Group ]
Took around 6 months of ground growing, and then after being dug up, left to regenerate
the fine feeder roots.

View attachment 185104

The last picture, the one with the measuring tape and the huge root... was that grown in the colander buried in the ground?

 

[Clicio]

To much compost and too much water retention.

As in all organic soil I guess.

 

[Anthony]

@Adair M ,

Yes Sifu and you commented that it was a shame that there was not more control.
in the growing - previously.

However, the objective was to

[1] See how fast it would thicken - result - under a year

[2] Give another section of the island's Bonsai groups as chance with a good cultivar.
Cuttings.

The plant is now in the hands of the head of that group. He likes big trunks, so he will
grow on, repair etc.

Here is another attempt and being given controlled growth.
Good Day
Anthony

Objective - 3 inch trunk and 6 branches.
Also in a colander
Then do again with an attractive shape.
Then do again ..........................

 

[BE.REAL]

Hello,
I have a bunch of large wooden shipping containers that I am repurposing to be growing beds for my trees. My question I have been pondering for awhile is if I should do colanders and then plant the colander in the containers, also if I needed to section off the different areas so each tree has its own little subdivision...rent free of course... Motha F'er's, haha.
after doing probably too much reading on colanders/ground growing/etc. thought a colander in the ground(this case the container acting as the ground) would defeat the purpose of the colander( roots reach the edge, meet light and air, prunes itself, and finer baby roots start further up that same root that met the edge. basically ramification of the root. Hence why colanders are create finer roots. ground creates big everything, since the roots can run wild and have no restrictions per se.

So please forgive my ignorance,
Do you plant in colander then take that and plant in ground? sure seems so?

I get the tile in ground, which works wonders.

just don't see the colander and ground together....thought it would be one before the other. IE ground for growth, then if need colander for finer roots, then into a B. pot.

Anyway, I realize there are a few ways to do things and I am trying numerous experiments this season, just curious on the colander in the ground idea.

Be well, and thanks for drop some knowledge.

 

[Vance Wood]

You are correct colanders in the ground is like putting a screen doors on a submarines. I know some people do it but it serves no purpose of realistic importance.

 

[milehigh_7]

Bro, bigger substrate...
View attachment 184129

Colanders sound like more watering work for me, let alone your climate. I feel their efficacy is somewhat overstated. But it's important to use what your comfortable with!

If you need bigger stones, I'm your man. shoot me a PM!

 

[milehigh_7]

No because the patent has expired and the Chinese ripped off the patent years ago. That's where the pond baskets and Anderson flats came from. I am not posting this to get sympathy but to explain that in my experience I have been working with this kind of thing for many years longer than most everyone. Most of the arguments and variations I keep hearing discussed are vapid.

For the record, I give you credit every time this discussion comes up. I have had IP stolen and it sucks. Thank you for your contribution to bonsai that can never be repaid. You are valued beyond words.

 

[Adair M]

Hello,
I have a bunch of large wooden shipping containers that I am repurposing to be growing beds for my trees. My question I have been pondering for awhile is if I should do colanders and then plant the colander in the containers, also if I needed to section off the different areas so each tree has its own little subdivision...rent free of course... Motha F'er's, haha.
after doing probably too much reading on colanders/ground growing/etc. thought a colander in the ground(this case the container acting as the ground) would defeat the purpose of the colander( roots reach the edge, meet light and air, prunes itself, and finer baby roots start further up that same root that met the edge. basically ramification of the root. Hence why colanders are create finer roots. ground creates big everything, since the roots can run wild and have no restrictions per se.

So please forgive my ignorance,
Do you plant in colander then take that and plant in ground? sure seems so?

I get the tile in ground, which works wonders.

just don't see the colander and ground together....thought it would be one before the other. IE ground for growth, then if need colander for finer roots, then into a B. pot.

Anyway, I realize there are a few ways to do things and I am trying numerous experiments this season, just curious on the colander in the ground idea.

Be well, and thanks for drop some knowledge.

Real, you got it. Burying a colander in the ground defeats the purpose of the colander.

Anthony grows tropical trees. They grow extremely quickly in his environment. They are different from the trees that grow up here in NorthAmerica.

If you live in the tropics like Anthony, and like the way his trees look, then do what he does. Otherwise, don’t. His trees and climate and growing methods might work for him, but they don’t in other climates.

 

[milehigh_7]

You are correct colanders in the ground is like putting a screen doors on a submarines. I know some people do it but it serves no purpose of realistic importance.

Thank you Vance! I get so tired of beating this drum.

 

[milehigh_7]

@Adair M told me recently...colanders are for pines.

Adair is right on many things but he is wrong on this.

There are some plants that naturally grow fibrous, shallow roots such as Euonymus, however, they still benefit from strainers because of the oxygenation factor and the fact that you can force loads more nutrients through. Think hydroponics.

 

[Vance Wood]

For the record, I give you credit every time this discussion comes up. I have had IP stolen and it sucks. Thank you for your contribution to bonsai that can never be repaid. You are valued beyond words.

Thank You for the recognition.

 

[Adair M]

Adair is right on many things but he is wrong on this.

There are some plants that naturally grow fibrous, shallow roots such as Euonymus, however, they still benefit from strainers because of the oxygenation factor and the fact that you can force loads more nutrients through. Think hydroponics.

I suppose you could grow anything you want in a colander. The point is Pines do best when they can grow for a while without having their root systems disturbed. And by that I mean several years. The colander method air prunes the roots so the roots don’t circle, but instead form fibrous roots close to the trunk. This is especially important for Shohin sized trees.

Trees that naturally form fibrous root systems close to the trunk don’t need a colanderto force them to do it. So you can use an attractive pot t develop them, rather than having to look at an ugly pond basket or colander.

Deciduous trees don’t mind getting barerooted every year. So, it’s better to use another technique, like the Ebihara board technique, to develop those.

Euonymus bonsai? I’m not sure I’ve ever seen one!

My point is, use the appropriate tool for the job. Would you go deer hunting with a shotgun? Or duck hunting with a rifle?