Thinking of buying JWP Pinus Parvifolia

[Driver170]

Guys this man from Belgium is selling this for 200 euro.

I love it but like usual my experience holds me back!

Whats your opinion on a JWP to start off on? I've done alot of reading got alot books on JWP and JBP even subscribed to Ryan neils videos

 

[Bonsai Nut]

What about your experience holds you back?

This JWP is on its own roots, unlike so many that we see here in the US that are grafted on JBP roots. As such it is a cold-hardy tree that will need a winter cold period every year. Should not be an issue where you live, but just know you will need to leave this tree out in the winter (or in a cold frame or unheated garage).

JWP is weaker and slower growing than JBP. It is also a single flush pine, so you will want to maintain the ramification and energy balance via pinching (versus outright candle removal).

As far as this specific tree goes, it has some design issues to contend with. The nebari isn't too good, especially with the one large surface root, and what appear to be a scar at the soil line. Also it has too big pruning scars that at least right now (in your photos) appear to be in the front of the tree. I would start by selecting a new front with those three scars at the back of the tree, arrange the branches to support the new design, and then carefully start to work on the nebari. Be cautious with JWP and their roots - they are very sensitive. I would advise not working all roots at once, and remove no more than 50% of the old soil in any repotting.

 

[LanceMac10]

Looks grafted to me....

 

[namnhi]

Looks graft to me as well. The black pine trunk was cut off right at the site where the graft. Looks pretty clear to me.

 

[Adair M]

Definitely grafted.

 

[Driver170]

Sounds like hands off on this one

 

[Adair M]

I love JWP, but not this one.

It appears the first branch was probably broken in shipment. (The big Jin). There are other transitions that are awkward, too. The wiring, while neatly done, is poor. He used far too much wire, and he turned all the tips up vertical. (Which is NOT the way to wire JWP.). He used a LOT of aluminum, which means he probably had difficulty getting the branches to stay where he wanted, which also means he stressed the tree during the wiring process.

I'd pass.

 

[Driver170]

I love JWP, but not this one.

It appears the first branch was probably broken in shipment. (The big Jin). There are other transitions that are awkward, too. The wiring, while neatly done, is poor. He used far too much wire, and he turned all the tips up vertical. (Which is NOT the way to wire JWP.). He used a LOT of aluminum, which means he probably had difficulty getting the branches to stay where he wanted, which also means he stressed the tree during the wiring process.

I'd pass.

Why is it not correct to wire the tips up vertical? I need to train my eye better at bonsai designs

 

[dirk hoorelbeke]

for that price don't buy. For 250 you can. Grafted and not the best stylistic possibilities.

 

[Driver170]

Thoughts on this one?

 

[dirk hoorelbeke]

Slender trunk with good bark, movement and small branches. Will take time to mature, but for 200€ might be a good tree. Are there no good trees in Scotland? Why searching in France? Do you know Peter Foele? Might be a good way to start, if he still gives classes, do it. If you want good pines and you are able to cross the water you better go hand-picking your own, i have some addresses. It will match your taste and budget better.

 

[Adair M]

Why is it not correct to wire the tips up vertical? I need to train my eye better at bonsai designs

Pines grow straight up. You wire them to point out, the new buds and candles will grow up. You don't need to wire them up, they'll do it on their own.

Now, you may say that all the good pines I see in pictures always show the needles pointing up. If I wire the tips pointing out to the side, some of the needles will be pointing down. But I never see that in the pictures, they're always pointing up.

What happens is when wiring, the last bit of wire is extended out, and gently cups the needles, supporting them so they don't point down. We call it a "fishhook". I made a post in the resources area with detailed pictures showing how it's done.

Granted, it's very subtle. However, that one little detail is indicative of the competency of the person who wired the tree. The multiple stands of wire are another red flag.

 

[Phillthy]

Pines grow straight up. You wire them to point out, the new buds and candles will grow up. You don't need to wire them up, they'll do it on their own.

Now, you may say that all the good pines I see in pictures always show the needles pointing up. If I wire the tips pointing out to the side, some of the needles will be pointing down. But I never see that in the pictures, they're always pointing up.

What happens is when wiring, the last bit of wire is extended out, and gently cups the needles, supporting them so they don't point down. We call it a "fishhook". I made a post in the resources area with detailed pictures showing how it's done.

Granted, it's very subtle. However, that one little detail is indicative of the competency of the person who wired the tree. The multiple stands of wire are another red flag.

Can you send us the link to said resources post about the "fishhook" I would love to see how it's done

 

[Bonsai Nut]

Looks grafted to me....

Yeah sorry, now that I look at it closer, it is definitely a graft. I'm not used to looking for such a high graft!

 

[Adair M]

Can you send us the link to said resources post about the "fishhook" I would love to see how it's done

https://www.bonsainut.com/threads/advanced-wiring-using-fishhooks.23797/

 

[Driver170]

Slender trunk with good bark, movement and small branches. Will take time to mature, but for 200€ might be a good tree. Are there no good trees in Scotland? Why searching in France? Do you know Peter Foele? Might be a good way to start, if he still gives classes, do it. If you want good pines and you are able to cross the water you better go hand-picking your own, i have some addresses. It will match your taste and budget better.

Hi i'm interested whats the details?