Thoughts on 'Ruby Loropetalum' as a bonsai? (I'd be looking to collect a ~3.5' tall shrub)

[SU2]

I've not used IBA on them in the past but I really don't think there would be any issue with using it. Who knows, maybe that's the secret to a successful start. Also, mixing in a teaspoon of Miracle Gro with the soil isn't going to hurt anything either. I would keep it in the shade until you start seeing some encouraging signs of a successful transplant. Misting the leaves isn't going to do a thing.

- Re IBA, I've googled and found enough anecdotes that say they use it (half the time I suspect the person hasn't even done the cuttings project they're writing about :/ ), haven't found one report that it's bad for any cultivar of loropetalum so am going to use it!

- Re ferts, yes I've got MG but it was too nitrogen-heavy, I've since gotten a high (35%!) phosphorous content so am going to mix those + my micronutrients/minerals formula to the mix while watering-in the soil (I use chopsticks for setting soil but use like 10gal+ on watering-in soil, just does such a great job!)

- Re shade, right now I'm unsure whether I should be doing a shaded area outside, or a shaded area in my patio.... am also considering tenting it, at least the first week (thoughts on that would be greatly appreciated!)

- Why do you say misting isn't going to do a thing? Right now I've got *way* more foliage than the roots can support, their transpiration will be a problem so not only will I be defoliating some of the lower-leaves on shoots but will definitely be misting to lessen transpiration losses (I wonder if there's an ambient humidity % that makes that useless, but on a windy/hot day I know misting prevents transpiration (and tenting obviously is the most sure way to keep it humid / reduce transpiration - seems smart the first week but I dunno, am hearing that it's smart from others but that it's bad idea from others....))

(btw I noticed you had your zone listed, feel so dumb for forgetting that as I remembered you were local to me it just didn't cross my mind when typing that question ;P )


Soil is pretty much done+ready (perlite, lava rock and some tan sphagnum), about to build that box now!! Will take pics of the roots I got, want your opinion!)

 

[SU2]

Oh FWIW after a quick google-scholar type search I found IBA further validated: http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/14620316.1996.11515453

Ok gg make the box, media/substrate's ready so make box + apply IBA, will be back w/ pics after as I'm assuming I'll need to lose a LOT of foliage off this guy, the foliage::root ration is wayyy heavy toward the former!!

 

[Vin]

 

[SU2]

I've made screened-bottom boxes before but used plywood for strips and they disintegrated pretty quickly and unfortunately don't think I have the spare wood to do real PT lumber for the bottom... substrate's ready, time to build the box - god I hope my neighbor doesn't get pissed!!

 

[SU2]

View attachment 159727

Those are some great looking boxes

Unfortunately last night when I finished prepping my soil and went to make my box, I lacked sufficient lumber I made-do with a plastic container, drilled a ton of holes in the bottom, but it's such thin plastic that it flexes, am half-considering building a box and transplanting it today (I grabbed a pallet this afternoon, one of my favorite scraps for building boxes with!), would you advise a day-2 repotting? Or just let it settle-in to its flimsy pot?


Look at all those branches!! I was able to retain a ton of growing-tips and never did any hard-chopping (though expect to once I know it's stable & ready), here's a pic from the back to show the branching (it was blocked by another bush so doesn't have much foliage on its rear), and one showing a close-up of the modest-but-interesting trunk:


Am realllllly hoping this guy survives, I'm pretty new so can't be sure but think this has a *lot* of potential!!

Have begun defoliating the lower-portions of the shoots, and am going to remove some branches (not going to remove a single growing-tip, major branch, etc) to balance the canopy's water requirements to the now-tiny roots!

 

[Vin]

I think you would be better off to repot into something with more stability even though you just put it in that container. Once it settles down you'll have a better opportunity to see what you have to work with. All there is to it at this point is to keep it alive.

 

[SU2]

I've placed that flimsy plastic container on a 1/2" thick piece of plywood, so I'm only handling it via that (am *never* touching that plastic), would you still advise swapping it? Am so worried of losing it that, now that I've got a solid 'tray' to maneuver that plastic box on, am worried it's better-off not having the re-box experience - with that said (the wooden carry-tray), would you still advise boxing it? I have gotten lumber now so can build a box, am just afraid of disturbing it!!

Have defoliated around 40-60% of the lower-leaves on all shoots (haven't removed any shoots yet but probably will remove a small amount) and am keeping it in my screened patio, putting a tarp over it (so quasi-greenhoused, like 75% not 100%, though I'm going and misting several times daily....anyways I've got a Q I'm hoping for your advice on, I've heard of using heating pads under plants to encourage rooting (just read about it in regards to this specie actually, though they were talking of rooting cuttings not transplanted material), I've got a generic heating-pad, should I put it under that pot or plywood?

Thanks again for all your help, I spent my first year of bonsai collecting easy (bougies, crapes) trees and am excited to have something like this but honestly am nervous as hell it's not gonna take, it's got a handful of the pink growing-tips and they're wilting pretty hard (not bad enough that the leaves stick together, but the growth tips are quite limp)

 

[Vin]

The tips are the first to wilt so I would just relax for now. The plywood at the bottom will help for sure as long as you don't move it around much. Truthfully, I'm not sure about the heating pad. Maybe someone else can chime in.

 

[SU2]

The tips are the first to wilt so I would just relax for now. The plywood at the bottom will help for sure as long as you don't move it around much. Truthfully, I'm not sure about the heating pad. Maybe someone else can chime in.

Yeah I always use the tips as my indicator, I'm on day 4 now and the handful of really soft, purple-ish growth tips are still as limp as day 2 but not looking so limp that they're going to die (yet....they're a nice indicator, they sagged pretty fast but seem to have stabilized at that sag, from my experiences once the thing stops declining, you've usually won! Usually it stops looking worse, then looks like it's doing nothing for a bit, then the first signs of new growth!)

And yeah the plywood seemed the smartest option, shouldn't disturb the roots when (carefully)moved and doesn't require disturbing them for re-pot, this container is small but should be sufficient for a season and by then it shouldn't have any trouble with a gentle re-potting!

(funnily enough it's in a 'real' greenhouse now, I don't know what you did with your trees but I loaded my screened patio, it's jam-packed I can hardly traverse it lol but got all-but-two bonsai inside - my first two yamadoris are stuck outside, their boxes are stationary Am so tempted to prune their 3'+ shoots so they don't get snapped but they're just not thick enough for pruning yet...)

Have a safe one man, you're probably already getting dumped-on (I'm north of you and it started pouring half an hour ago here)

 

[SU2]

How'd you fare through the storm? I had a huge Oak come down in my backyard, and while it unfortunately clipped my (diagonal)neighbors' gutters I couldn't help but hold back the biggest grin - that tree was the bane of my nursery's existence, my backyard was 85%+ full-shade because of that tree and I grow tropicals almost exclusively, so could only use a sliver of my yard- now I've got an entire backyard to plan-out a nursery design for

The Ruby still hasn't stabilized, I did a 2nd defoliation the other day (and a first pruning, very light - I removed maybe 5-10 real thin branches, selecting those whose leaves were the worst-off), and for the past few days have been giving it a few hours in the sun - am giving it a little more time each day, unsure whether more light is going to help or hurt though (with a bougie, I'd know for sure that the sun was helping me, but I've never had a tree with this type of leaves, I'm having a lot of trouble deciding whether it's doing OK or not and really unsure whether getting it in the sun sooner, or later, is beneficial..)

 

[M. Frary]

g-tip there to grow, and leave it in-ground til spring

What happened to this?

 

[Vin]

Everything is fine at my house. Just a bazillion leaves and small branches to pick up. Glad you got the sun you wanted.

I would keep the loropetalum in the shade for at least a few weeks. As I said earlier, they are finicky and need time to recover. As long as it keeps most of its leaves it should be fine. Don't expect it to take off until spring.

 

[SU2]

What happened to this?

Chose against it after hearing Rock's disapproval of 2-stepping!

 

[SU2]

Everything is fine at my house. Just a bazillion leaves and small branches to pick up. Glad you got the sun you wanted.

I would keep the loropetalum in the shade for at least a few weeks. As I said earlier, they are finicky and need time to recover. As long as it keeps most of its leaves it should be fine. Don't expect it to take off until spring.

Glad to hear nothing serious!! And thanks, am beyond-psyched at my new, far-larger nursery

Are you thinking shade like dappled shade under a tree, or in my screened patio? And it's been dropping leaves, I've done 3 rounds of defoliation to keep ahead of it but still afraid it's wanting more light and that I'm restricting it...am going to look into its history/where it comes from to get a better idea exactly what it wants

 

[SU2]

Here's a couple pics from last night, before I did defoliation #3: [edit- it was actually half defoliation and half removal of excess shoots, like if a thin branch had 7 shoots coming from it I removed a couple of the weaker ones (assessed by what leaves were the driest]

 

[choppychoppy]

I don't know if I like them or not I've got several from a buddies yard. Here are a couple I shoved into pots a couple years ago and roughly shaped with some trimming. Haven't really done much with them though.

 

[Vin]

It just needs time to recover. Dappled shade under a tree would be fine. I would cut it somewhere close to the line I made to help with transpiration and stop defoliating it. That's about all the advice I can give you.

 

[SU2]

I don't know if I like them or not I've got several from a buddies yard. Here are a couple I shoved into pots a couple years ago and roughly shaped with some trimming. Haven't really done much with them though.

View attachment 161067 View attachment 161068

I like them!! You must have some great trees if you're not even sure you like those

Your profile says SE, I wonder how different your climate is compared to me (FL 9a/9b line) but have to ask you- how difficult were they to transplant? Were those two the only ones that made it? (you mention having gotten several) What do you think of how mine's looking right now? (not in terms of style or potential, just health)

 

[SU2]

It just needs time to recover. Dappled shade under a tree would be fine. I would cut it somewhere close to the line I made to help with transpiration and stop defoliating it. That's about all the advice I can give you.

View attachment 161072

Do you mean to do such a cutting now, instead of defoliating? I'd always thought it was the other way around, that defoliation is better as it leaves the reserves in the cambium while lessening transpiration - honestly I'd been hesitant to cut any apical tips so did my prunings/defoliations in a way that left pretty much every true tip intact.

Thanks again for all the help, has been great having someone with experience to help walk me through this

 

[choppychoppy]

I like them!! You must have some great trees if you're not even sure you like those

Your profile says SE, I wonder how different your climate is compared to me (FL 9a/9b line) but have to ask you- how difficult were they to transplant? Were those two the only ones that made it? (you mention having gotten several) What do you think of how mine's looking right now? (not in terms of style or potential, just health)

They were dug up - put in a truck - and my landscaping guy pitched em all over my fence. They sat out for about 4 hrs and when I got home I saw em. I cut all the rootballs and the tops way back potted into 3/5 gal nursery pots with standard nursery mix (potting soil & bark). I just cut them all back a couple times a year. I potted the two pictured immediately into bonsai pots as they had almost 0 roots and fit easily with no more pruning by me - it had already been done with a backhoe haha. They grow like weeds here - I am in Gainesville btw so not too far from you. I didn't know they were able to be killed they live with horrible abuse and little care and seem to be fine.

And 'defoliating' trees is almost exclusively a refinement technique and should never been done on developing trees. Probably 90% of the time someone defoliates a tree it is totally incorrect for the stage of development.

I would do the cutback @Vin suggested but there is really no reason to defoliated this tree probably ever in its entire life. The leaves will reduce on their own with constant pruning and this tree sheds it's old leaves regularly.