Ever seen scale growth on a procumbens?

[MichaelS]

So you actually read all of his posts.
And you commented on this one.
Not only are you ignorant about junipers you also are a liar.
You've never seen scale foliage on a procumbens?
Or a San Jose?
Which one.
They will both grow adult foliage.
You really ought to get out of your safe space and look around some.
Maybe you could learn something useful here.

What a tangled, incoherent mess your mind must be. Perhaps a psychiatrist might help?

 

[MichaelS]

I have two Chinesis juniperus procumbens ‘nana’ and they both show a little scale foliage. They are not genetically novel. They are standard genetic lines propagated in the nursery trades. (Take note of where I live.)

This is a bonsai I repotted in 2018
View attachment 269564

This is a 3-gallon nursery can I picked up about a month ago
View attachment 269563
View attachment 269565

These are truly sports of scale foliage. These branches are not just “growing out” and expanding. They are a stable scale form. Additional shoots of these plants will convert to the scale form if I do not induce environmental stressors.

Another possibility is that a procumbens somewhere threw a ''sport'' with scale foliage and it was propagated inadvertently or purposefully and all other procumbens in the US were propagated from that clone? As I said. They don't have scale foliage here. Yet another possibility is that the US ones are male and the AU ones are female as I notice pollen masses there.

 

[MichaelS]

There are a lot of correlations between Gump and MichaelS.
But it isn't nice to talk about ones intellect or lack thereof.
But then again nobody ever accused me of being nice.

...And so go the desperate ramblings of a mad man. If you keep going I'm will start feeling pity for you. Is that what you're seeking?

 

[M. Frary]

I wasn't commenting on his intellect or lack thereof, but rather the way he approaches subjects. He's got his story and he tells it well, with conviction. Doesn't make it right, though. BTW, in the Gump case, the story Gump was telling was actually true, so could MS be right about procumbens? Is it possible that every "procumbens" that all of us have seen with scale foliage (and I have 2 that are labeled as procumbens that get scale foliage) is really San Jose? I kind of doubt it, but I suppose it's within the realm of possiblity. More likely though is that MS is incorrect, a concept that may be difficult for him to imagine.

As an aside, I haven't read one of his posts in months, he went on the ignore list quite a while ago. Forum life is much better that way.

Sad to say I had to exile him to iggy isle too again.

 

[Underdog]

Then work with pines.

I'm trying a couple now to learn on but the needles look out of "scale" to me on a 12" tree no matter how much you reduce them.

 

[parhamr]

Another possibility is that a procumbens somewhere threw a ''sport'' with scale foliage and it was propagated inadvertently or purposefully and all other procumbens in the US were propagated from that clone? As I said. They don't have scale foliage here. Yet another possibility is that the US ones are male and the AU ones are female as I notice pollen masses there.

Are you moving goalposts?

 

[PABonsai]

Are you moving goalposts?

Yes, his argument in support of the assertion that procumbens do not get scale foliage is that maybe some do that he hasn't seen. An odd proposition, no?

 

[MichaelS]

Are you moving goalposts?

I am adding another possibility into the discussion which neither side can use to advantage, but may help to illuminate. So the answer to you question is no.

 

[MichaelS]

Sad to say I had to exile him to iggy isle too again.

So you need a button to ignore someone? You are so full of shit it must be oozing out of your ears.

 

[parhamr]

I am adding another possibility into the discussion which neither side can use to advantage, but may help to illuminate. So the answer to you question is no.

k

 

[Adair M]

Here are pictures taken at Plant City’s famous “Sea of Junipers”:





And some close ups:







A rough guess says that about half of them have fully gone scale, about a third have both types of foliage, and the rest are straight juvenile.

 

[parhamr]

Here are pictures taken at Plant City’s famous “Sea of Junipers”:

View attachment 269702

View attachment 269701

And some close ups:

View attachment 269700

View attachment 269699

View attachment 269698

A rough guess says that about half of them have fully gone scale, about a third have both types of foliage, and the rest are straight juvenile.

Okay, but hear me out… this thorough evidence you’ve presented of an entire fucking field of proof to the contrary is invalid because of this one reason I have constructed in my head that specifically and unrealistically negates your evidence! Logic!

 

[MichaelS]

Here are pictures taken at Plant City’s famous “Sea of Junipers”:

View attachment 269702

View attachment 269701

And some close ups:

View attachment 269700

View attachment 269699

View attachment 269698

A rough guess says that about half of them have fully gone scale, about a third have both types of foliage, and the rest are straight juvenile.

Yes very nice Adair but you've already shown those kind of pictures before. What did you expect to achieve by showing more? Do you thing it compounds your argument? Remind me not to use you as a lawyer!

 

[_#1_]

Yes very nice Adair but you've already shown those kind of pictures before. What did you expect to achieve by showing more? Do you thing it compounds your argument?

Um... I'm only about 4 years into bonsai (plants in general actually). For the sake of me further learning how to id trees, do procumbens make scale foliage?

A bigger man can admit he's wrong. Unless he's right!

 

[Adair M]

Yes very nice Adair but you've already shown those kind of pictures before. What did you expect to achieve by showing more? Do you thing it compounds your argument? Remind me not to use you as a lawyer!

Have I? In this thread? Really??? I just went back and reviewed the thread, and I didn’t see where I’ve posted any pictures.

Regardless, what is it about the pictures you don’t believe?

I just happened to be at Plant City, so I snapped a couple of pictures. I’m no lawyer, not trying to be one. I am, however, a witness to the fact that Procumbens can sometimes have scale foliage!

 

[parhamr]

do procumbens make scale foliage?

Yes.

 

[coh]

Yes.

Only seeing part of this conversation but I can imagine who else is saying what. Reminds me of the classic scene from "A Few Good Men":

Everyone else: "DO PROCUMBENS GET SCALE FOLIAGE?"
MS: No!

Everyone else: "DO PROCUMBENS GET SCALE FOLIAGE? I WANT THE TRUTH!"
MS: YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!

Everyone else: DO PROCUMBENS GET SCALE FOLIAGE?"
MS: YOU'RE DAMN RIGHT THEY DO!

Has he admitted it yet? LOL.

 

[MichaelS]

Have I? In this thread? Really??? I just went back and reviewed the thread, and I didn’t see where I’ve posted any pictures.

Regardless, what is it about the pictures you don’t believe?

Jezzuz! What does it take?? Do I have to hold your hand though every point? It's like trying to reason with wombat.
I never said this post and there is nothing about the pictures that I don't believe. It's obviously a juniper with both scale and needle foliage which you and others say is procumbens. You have shown it before. It doesn't change anything. My procumbens does not, never has and never will have scale foliage. I posted some ideas as to why that may be. It has been root bound and starved but does not produce scale foliage. I have never seen procumbens produce scale foliage in this country. There are 2 possibilities. 1, procumbens does not have scale foliage as the botanists say it doesn't and you have something else which you think is the real procumbens, or 2, Some do and some don't.
If someone tells you it is procumbens, that is not proof it is. The same goes for me. Botanically speaking, my example of this species matches better than yours until you come up with a botanical description which disagrees.
END!

 

[MichaelS]

Only seeing part of this conversation but I can imagine who else is saying what. Reminds me of the classic scene from "A Few Good Men":

Everyone else: "DO PROCUMBENS GET SCALE FOLIAGE?"
MS: No!

Everyone else: "DO PROCUMBENS GET SCALE FOLIAGE? I WANT THE TRUTH!"
MS: YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!

Everyone else: DO PROCUMBENS GET SCALE FOLIAGE?"
MS: YOU'RE DAMN RIGHT THEY DO!

Has he admitted it yet? LOL.

Simpleton.

 

[leatherback]

Another possibility is that a procumbens somewhere threw a ''sport'' with scale foliage and it was propagated inadvertently or purposefully

It is an almost brilliant suggestion. If only you would have read that 4 pages ago before you started cursing the whole world.

So what we can learn? no much, maybe different clones or species or bad nomenclature in the nurserys as said before

Maybe stop shouting, start reading and thinking. Think you can do that for a change?