Quercus ilex

milehigh_7

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I need some help. I was at the local nursery buying some of that Bayer systemic that everyone suggested and I took a stroll out to the back where the damaged trees were. I found three Quercus ilex in 24" boxes. (I will post pictures tomorrow or Saturday) I will wait to see what you all say about them once you see them to tell you what I paid.

Anyway, they are in pretty rough shape one is leaning over about to fall out of it's box. They are all popping leaves however.

My question is should I just leave them in the box till fall? Feed them good and let them strengthen up a bit before taking them out? The days are starting to get into the 80s now. I don't want to transplant them to late.

If the answer is to go ahead and transplant them, how much root work can be done on this species safely?

Thanks a million, any other tips on this species would be greatly appreciated!
 
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milehigh_7

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:(Ok everyone, I am sure somebody on here knows about this species. I really do need advice on how to proceed. Pretty please??? :( I am anticipating several years to fix the roots that I am sure are a mess so suggestions for progression steps would be very appreciated.

Anyway here are the pictures I promised:
The first is a pic of all three and one of the leaves

Then a new post for each tree

Even if you tell me they are junk it will be fine. By the way I paid $70 for all three. The nursery normally sells 24" boxes for $150 each.
 

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milehigh_7

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Q. ilex 1

Here are pics of the first tree this one is about to fall out of its box. As you can see it measures just over 2" caliper.
 

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milehigh_7

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Tree 2

Healthiest but skinniest at about 1.5 inch caliper.
 

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milehigh_7

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Tree three

Here is the last one at just about 2" caliper
 

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Bonsai Nut

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I am by no means an expert, but I have a lot of difficulty getting these to bud back on old bark and they are very apex dominant. I have one that I trimmed back back pretty hard and lost several main branches - all the returning growth occurred in the top 25% of the tree with almost no budding below.

I am going to try to airlayer one that I have currently and hope that I get strong budding lower on the trunk below the layer. However I have no assumption of success - I may lose the tree if it continues to refuse to backbud.
 

milehigh_7

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Mom, just going by that article I seem to have the subspecies rotundifolia (syn. Q. rotundifolia, Q. ballota). Leaves are about the size of a quarter stretched out on one end.

BNut, the second and third of these have buds on the trunk. I am just not sure how (and how fast) and when to transition them out of these boxes so I can begin working on them.

I really just need some advice on next steps and suggested time tables for the work ahead.


Evidently, there are those who use this species for bonsai. I found an example over at AoB it is the work of Mauro Stemberger:
 
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irene_b

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Cool....contact him and find out some of the keys to keeping it super happy.
Mom
 

PaulH

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Are you sure about the ID? At least one looks like Q. suber to me.
 

milehigh_7

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Cool....contact him and find out some of the keys to keeping it super happy.
Mom

Mom, in lieu of anybody on BNut or BTalk offering help I was able to track down a couple of e-mail addresses for Mauro Stemberger and have sent him a mail asking for advice. We will see what comes of that.

I guess my biggest question is if I should try to get them out of the boxes at this late date or if I should wait till winter. Second would be when to start and how they respond to trunk chopping.

Seems like they would be good trees with the corky bark and the small leaves. I know they do well here in Vegas so I hope they respond well to pot culture.
 
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Bonsai Nut

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Are you sure about the ID? At least one looks like Q. suber to me.

Thanks Paul. I was feeling stupid because I mixed up the Latin names :) I responded to this post thinking he was showing a Q. suber - that is the tree I have. I do not have a Q. ilex.
 

milehigh_7

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Thanks Paul. I was feeling stupid because I mixed up the Latin names :) I responded to this post thinking he was showing a Q. suber - that is the tree I have. I do not have a Q. ilex.

Well in the linked gallery, Mauro has a suber right above the ilex. Ilex must not be the best bonsai subject or there would be more of them I am assuming. I wonder if care would be similar to other evergreen oaks. If so does anyone have advice based on that? Let's say these were Quercus virginiana (or another evergreen), what would you do?
 
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irene_b

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I have a live oak that I have been working with....I am taking baby steps with it as I have killed several before... Mine has backbudded great this year and I am developing a bit more trust in working on it more.
It is in my mix so I know it can handle free flowing soil less mix.
I feed well with whatever is at hand ie: Aoki, Osmocote,Miracle gro, fish shyt,etc.
The leaves are reducing well.
Seems to be critter free (which is a plus).
I do keep it in filtered sunlight (This is South Texas).
I have not wired it yet so no idea how or if it will have wire damage.
Hope this helps.
Irene
 

milehigh_7

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Mauro's Advice

First Mauro seems like a great guy. I don't know if any of you know him but he has been very gracious and helpful.

I left my laptop home so I can't put up exactly what he said (I will post it later). However, he said over all they are good to work with. They backbud well and are real forgiving (which will be good). He said they take wire well also. The only challenge on these is the roots. I guess you have to be real careful not to be overly aggressive with them.

So there is the BonsaiNut shell version. :D
 

irene_b

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First Mauro seems like a great guy. I don't know if any of you know him but he has been very gracious and helpful.

I left my laptop home so I can't put up exactly what he said (I will post it later). However, he said over all they are good to work with. They backbud well and are real forgiving (which will be good). He said they take wire well also. The only challenge on these is the roots. I guess you have to be real careful not to be overly aggressive with them.

So there is the BonsaiNut shell version. :D
Ummm I will agree about the roots....The others that I killed was because of root work...
Irene
 

meushi

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Just to make you wait a bit until I'm done picking the friend's brain, his latest Q Ilex yamadori... a rescue from a quarry, removed before they blasted the area.

Quercus_ilex.jpg
 

meushi

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Ok, to sum it up... my friend said to treat like a quercus suber:

Fast grower, feed aplenty.
Fast draining soil on the neutral side, needs added calcium
Backbuds very easily
With correct culture conditions, you might have to prune it back to shape up to 7 times a year.
Use sapdrawers to increase the branches diameter.

To ramify it, use the same technique as for olive trees or prunus mahaleb.

Chop back the tap root over 3 repottings, cut about 1/3 each time
 
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milehigh_7

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Ok, to sum it up... my friend said to treat like a quercus suber:

Fast grower, feed aplenty.
Fast draining soil on the neutral side, needs added calcium
Backbuds very easily
With correct culture conditions, you might have to prune it back to shape up to 7 times a year.
Use sapdrawers to increase the branches diameter.

To ramify it, use the same technique as for olive trees or prunus mahaleb.

Chop back the tap root over 3 repottings, cut about 1/3 each time


Meushi,

Thank you SOOO much! This fits nicely into Mauro's advice. What exactly is a "sapdrawer"? Is that a sacrifice branch?

My very specific problem is the best way to get these things out of the nursery boxes in which I am sure the roots are a tangled mess. I am concerned as I know the roots are fragile.


Thanks again!
 
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