Ever seen scale growth on a procumbens?

Arnold

Sapling
Messages
48
Reaction score
71
Location
Canary Islands, Spain
Yeah, no one single scale in those very very old ones

These two in the United States National Bonsai & Penjing Museum:

This beautiful tree no one single scale in any photo I have seen:


But this other with scales mixed with prickly:

 
Last edited:

TN_Jim

Omono
Messages
1,423
Reaction score
1,442
Location
Nashville TN
USDA Zone
7a
You sound like a Californian I met once. He was fix'n to start his own space program by selling stale donuts.
I actually know that guy.
J. nana with scale foliage, must be a witch, burn it🤣
 

Adair M

Pinus Envy
Messages
13,125
Reaction score
29,608
Location
NEGeorgia
USDA Zone
7a
That's not procumbems nana. They are bluer for a start
Juniper foliage color can vary based upon local climate, water, soil, fertilizer, local humidity, elevation...

For example, most everyone’s collected Sierra Junipers are blue. But up in the mountains where they were collected, they’re green. Go figure.

Anyway, here is the Procumbens I showed earlier next to one of my friend’s shimpaku:

4F50E5B2-F082-418B-A34D-7D45BC7BF4EF.jpeg

It is a different shade of green. More “blueish”. (I used one of my friend’s shimpaku rather than one of my own because he uses a different fertilizer than I do.)

Anyway, I don’t think Michael and I will ever agree on this. I am not alone in having seen Procumbens with scale foliage.
 

coh

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
5,499
Reaction score
6,085
Location
Rochester, NY
USDA Zone
6
Surprised this thread is still going.
Why don't you just agree that you do not agree. Without actually putting the species next to eachother, or through a DNA analysis, you will not agree what is or is not a procumbens.
Where would the fun be in that?

Don't forget the basic operating philosophy of the internet:

Never stop arguing about something you can never prove with someone you'll never meet.

And of course, never say never.
 

amcoffeegirl

Masterpiece
Messages
2,343
Reaction score
3,618
Location
Des Moines, IA
USDA Zone
5b
Posting with Bjorn’s permission-

To answer your question:
There is the standard Juniperus procumbens, which grows in the higher elevation mountains of Japan, including in the Japanese Alps. This species tends to produce very hard deadwood and interesting twisted trunklines. The foliage on this species is somewhat coarse and does not (to my knowledge) produce scale-like foliage (although that's not to say it's an impossibility).

What you find more commonly in the US is Juniperus procumbens 'nana' which is the dwarf version of the standard procumbens in Japan. This cultivar has more compact foliage and can potentially produce scale-like foliage given certain environmental conditions. So for example, it is less likely to produce scale-like foliage in the hot humid temps of TN, but much more likely to produce that foliage in the cooler environment of the Bay Area in San Francisco. Older examples of 'nana' also seem more likely to produce scale foliage than younger examples.

With all that said, though, it is unlikely that a procumbens 'nana' will produce 100% scale foliage across the entire tree. More often than not, you'll find a mix of juvenile and scale foliage on any given plant.
 
Messages
954
Reaction score
1,660
Location
Tennessee
USDA Zone
7a
What you find more commonly in the US is Juniperus procumbens 'nana' which is the dwarf version of the standard procumbens in Japan.
Dang, I could have saved us all a lot of time if I'd said "procumbens nana" instead of just "procumbans" in my original post. Sorry guys, my bad. :D
 

coh

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
5,499
Reaction score
6,085
Location
Rochester, NY
USDA Zone
6
This conv has gone on for years and I am pleased to have it finally wrapped up. Lol
Oh you think that's gonna wrap it up, do you? You don't know these folks very well!

Personally, I have a few of these "nana" plants and I like them but wish they would either stay all needle or go to all scale. The needle growth is actually quite nice and compact but I don't care for the mixture of both types. It looks messy.
 

amcoffeegirl

Masterpiece
Messages
2,343
Reaction score
3,618
Location
Des Moines, IA
USDA Zone
5b
Oh you think that's gonna wrap it up, do you? You don't know these folks very well!

Personally, I have a few of these "nana" plants and I like them but wish they would either stay all needle or go to all scale. The needle growth is actually quite nice and compact but I don't care for the mixture of both types. It looks messy.
Well it’s a wrap for me. 😆
I do like them also. I killed mine but I will try again.
 

Adair M

Pinus Envy
Messages
13,125
Reaction score
29,608
Location
NEGeorgia
USDA Zone
7a
Oh you think that's gonna wrap it up, do you? You don't know these folks very well!

Personally, I have a few of these "nana" plants and I like them but wish they would either stay all needle or go to all scale. The needle growth is actually quite nice and compact but I don't care for the mixture of both types. It looks messy.
I agree.

They’re also what everyone starts doing bonsai with. Myself included. So, there’s lots and lots of “beginner bonsai” Procumbens nana.

And, well, I’ve come to associate them with the beginner “sticks in pots” and “mallsai”. Even if it’s well developed! Yeah, I know, that’s a “guilt by association” prejudice on my part, but, it is what it is.
 

coh

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
5,499
Reaction score
6,085
Location
Rochester, NY
USDA Zone
6
I agree.

They’re also what everyone starts doing bonsai with. Myself included. So, there’s lots and lots of “beginner bonsai” Procumbens nana.

And, well, I’ve come to associate them with the beginner “sticks in pots” and “mallsai”. Even if it’s well developed! Yeah, I know, that’s a “guilt by association” prejudice on my part, but, it is what it is.
To me, the classic beginner "stick in pot" or "mallsai" will always be those horrific "ginseng" ficus. Though procumbens would be a close second.
 

leatherback

Imperial Masterpiece
Messages
6,480
Reaction score
10,037
Location
Northern Germany
USDA Zone
7
And, well, I’ve come to associate them with the beginner “sticks in pots” and “mallsai”. Even if it’s well developed! Yeah, I know, that’s a “guilt by association” prejudice on my part, but, it is what it is.
To me, the classic beginner "stick in pot" or "mallsai" will always be those horrific "ginseng" ficus. Though procumbens would be a close second.
Hm.. I disagree. S-elm would top the list!
 
Top Bottom