A Beginner's Hello and a Question

[Jrmcmich]

I think that a nursery stock Juniper might indeed be the way to go to try my hand at styling. I'm gonna keep an eye out next time I am at the nursery! That's also helpful too about waiting 2 years. The biggest question on my mind at the moment is when can I do wiring? Like how soon can I do it? Is wiring a recently repotted tree bad? What about my ficus that was repotted recently but is already making new growth, could I wire him now since he is so healthy?

I have done wiring on many trees but have never truly wired an entire tree which if you find any videos or books that show that is definitely a process and can see why often people will wire without leaves to see structure. I have broken this no real work to trees to add shape and such. But one last point on wiring is when you think it looks not bad and your like just a touch more bending be careful bc you might hear a crack of the branch. Did that too many times first 2 years. Even now have still done that especially with Japanese maples. I have a European hornbeam that takes bending pretty well as long as not crazy large branches

 

[FicusForager]

Go to some bonsai shows see actual bonsai find a decent honest seller.

I want to so bad! Next week will be the first meet up of my local club that I will be able to attend and I'm excited to see what is out there and local! Unfortunately my local botanical garden only does Bonsai shows twice a year in spring and fall but I am excited to go to those as well.

This is one tree I bought three years into bonsai. It’s an oak and I had to learn very quickly what to thirty years later there result

Oh my goodness what an absolutely stunning tree! Thank you for sharing! Makes me excited for the future

 

[Wulfskaar]

Alright, I read a lot of stuff that says this but I am a smidge confused. Because I have also read a lot of those "buy a plant and make it a bonsai in one afternoon" type dealios. But what exactly am I looking for at nurseries? Because I think I get there and get overwhelmed because my local nursery has a highly extensive "Bonsai section" with trees like mine that are pictured, to already shaped 10/20 year old trees, to full on chumonos in fancy pots. I would like to do more work on my plants but I don't want to mess with the little guys too much because I want them to be healthy. AND almost all those nursery stock demos are with Junipers which I'm told are not the beginner friendliest and definitely not inside boys. So what kinda stuff should I actually be looking for in this option? And would this also be where the advice to not immediately plant them in a bonsai pot comes in?

Please remember that I also have a lot to learn, but I'm willing to share what I know.

Generally speaking, getting a nursery tree saves you years of growth time, but also needs years of development (which is half the fun, in my opinion). Of course, you can get a more finished and expensive bonsai and always continue development, like @rockm did with his wonderful oak tree.

Things to look for in nursery stock:
1. Species that is good for bonsai, and native to your area or grows well in your climate.
2. Look at trunk and nebari. Do they still need years of growth?
3. How long will it take to end up in a bonsai pot vs how much time are you willing to spend on it?

 

[rockm]

I want to so bad! Next week will be the first meet up of my local club that I will be able to attend and I'm excited to see what is out there and local! Unfortunately my local botanical garden only does Bonsai shows twice a year in spring and fall but I am excited to go to those as well.

Oh my goodness what an absolutely stunning tree! Thank you for sharing! Makes me excited for the future

Bottom line study good bonsai. Get to know more experienced bonsaists. Stretch yourself a bit. Kill some trees experimenting techniques and practices (cheaper stuff obviously). You WILL NOT learn much online as far as what you’re supposed to do physically. Theory online is cheap. Hands on teaches IRL.

Talk to people IN PERSON at bonsai events. I know Utah probably isn’t the easiest place to learn but there bonsai folks around. Ask them if you can help them out in the “busy season” of spring with repotting pruning. Mixing soil etc. be humble and ready to help. Ask WHY? and How? A lot.

Expect failures. Keep going in spite of them. The initial learning curve is VERY steep. Learn from the mistakes you make.

 

[leatherback]

I was going to ask if I could ask you more questions, but I found your website so I am going to explore there first! If I do end up having more questions though, can I reply to you on this thread or would you prefer direct messages?

I would recommend using the strength of this forum rather than personal messages. That way you do not depend on the opinion of a single person. Using the [at] symbol and then start typing someones username you can tag people and they get notified of being mentioned. @FicusForager

Website = youtube? My text websites have not been updated in 2 years I am afraid. Maybe I should start working on those a bit again. Hm.

 

[Shibui]

I was hoping that you specifically would see this because I saw on another thread that someone had dubbed you the Serissa expert lol. I'm curious, do you think she should be on the window sill in the picture all day like my Ficuses or do you think she would do better a little further away in less direct light? Or maybe have her on the sill for part of the day and in more shade for another part?

Not sure what deluded person believes I am a Serissa expert. I have one that was gifted to me by a friend moving away and have struck lots of cuttings and suckers from that original plant but I still don't have a good serissa bonsai.
Up to this winter, all my Serissas have lived outdoors all year round. Most survive our mild winter but this year I've popped them into the greenhouse for winter to see what difference that makes.
Direct sun through a window can be much stronger than direct outside. Serissa seem to cope with lower light levels (hence can survive indoors) so try it a little further from the glass for a while. I prefer to find a spot and leave the trees there. Every time you move one it takes a few days to readjust to the new conditions so regular moving can be detrimental and there will be times you are not home to move it away from the window. Relying on moving daily is likely to end in tragedy. If you can find a spot with some morning sun but shaded as the sun moves that's probably best.

I also saw on other threads that over watering is a real problem for these guys so I am thinking I should maybe let her get a little drier before watering? Should she dry all the way out or should I wait until about half way down is dry? So far I've been watering when about 3/4 inch is dry.

Overwatering is a problem for almost all trees. How much problem depends on the soil type more than anything but we can learn to water according to any soil, pot and plant.
Letting a pot completely dry out is asking for trouble. Just a bit too far and the tree can dehydrate and die. 1/2 dry should be about right. Maybe the pot is deeper than it looks in the photos. I was guessing 3/4" would be about half the pot anyway? The new shoots on my serissas seem to start to droop when they are getting close to dry so that may be another gauge to look for.

I'm wondering what the general attitude is around buying already mature old bonsai. My nursery has some beautiful and likely quite old trees. But I'm wondering how that is viewed in the hobby?

I'm a DIY guy so I prefer to develop my trees from scratch. That way I own all the mistakes as well as anything good. Plenty of people, including some very respected bonsai growers, who are happy to pay for tree that someone else has developed. I guess they just want to have something great without the hassle and time to grow it. Either way is fine

 

[Nera]

Regarding getting "older/close to finished bonsai" - besides the huge price tag for them, for me I prefer to get bonsai I am able to develop myself. Personally I'm not too concerned about age when purchasing, if a tree looks good to me I'll get it and work on it. I am not looking to develop huge trunk thickness (that's my personal preference) but also not a skinny cutting. You can certainly find good potential material at a nursery if you look at their tree stock, just need to know what to look for when purchasing (taper, roots, etc).

 

[Nickuk74]

Hi, regarding your figs, you might want to watch this series. It's really useful.

I'm in the UK and I put mine outside as soon as the weather allows. They protest for a few weeks (I get a bit of leaf scorch, so start them off in the shade), then they grow like weeds. Already have 2 feet to growth which I have cutback and am awaiting for the next flush. The trunks have almost doubled in size this year alone.

Good luck!

 

[Orion_metalhead]

Welcome, nothing to add really. Ficus cuttings root incredibly well so when pruning you can multiply your ficus very easy to get new trees.

 

[FicusForager]

Please remember that I also have a lot to learn, but I'm willing to share what I know.

Generally speaking, getting a nursery tree saves you years of growth time, but also needs years of development (which is half the fun, in my opinion). Of course, you can get a more finished and expensive bonsai and always continue development, like @rockm did with his wonderful oak tree.

Things to look for in nursery stock:
1. Species that is good for bonsai, and native to your area or grows well in your climate.
2. Look at trunk and nebari. Do they still need years of growth?
3. How long will it take to end up in a bonsai pot vs how much time are you willing to spend on it?

This advice was taken to heart! Yesterday I just went to the nursery to look and I tried to keep all this in mind and wrote down more species to look into the specifics of! One I am especially intrigued by is Boxwoods.

 

[FicusForager]

Ask them if you can help them out in the “busy season” of spring with repotting pruning. Mixing soil etc. be humble and ready to help. Ask WHY? and How? A lot.

Oh my goodness this is such a good idea! I really hope I can get someone to take me under their wing, it sounds so fun to be able to work with someone one on one in the spring and learn that way.

 

[FicusForager]

I would recommend using the strength of this forum rather than personal messages. That way you do not depend on the opinion of a single person. Using the [at] symbol and then start typing someones username you can tag people and they get notified of being mentioned. @FicusForager

This is great advice! Combined knowledge base is very powerful.

Website = youtube? My text websites have not been updated in 2 years I am afraid. Maybe I should start working on those a bit again. Hm.

I did mean website but instead I spent most of yesterday watching your youtube videos and they were incredibly helpful to me! Most of the questions I would have asked were actually answered in your videos. So thanks, Jelle!

One thing is I am curious about is what people's thoughts are on Boxwood trees for bonsai? My nursery has an amazing selection of them and I would love to take one home and style it (but following your videos' advice Jelle, I will not repot until the right season ).

 

[FicusForager]

Not sure what deluded person believes I am a Serissa expert.

Lol so sorry, thanks for your help either way though

Direct sun through a window can be much stronger than direct outside. Serissa seem to cope with lower light levels (hence can survive indoors) so try it a little further from the glass for a while. I prefer to find a spot and leave the trees there. Every time you move one it takes a few days to readjust to the new conditions so regular moving can be detrimental and there will be times you are not home to move it away from the window. Relying on moving daily is likely to end in tragedy. If you can find a spot with some morning sun but shaded as the sun moves that's probably best.

This is all very very helpful and will be taken to heart.

Overwatering is a problem for almost all trees. How much problem depends on the soil type more than anything but we can learn to water according to any soil, pot and plant.
Letting a pot completely dry out is asking for trouble. Just a bit too far and the tree can dehydrate and die. 1/2 dry should be about right. Maybe the pot is deeper than it looks in the photos. I was guessing 3/4" would be about half the pot anyway?

I think you're right and I am just bad at math lol. This is good, it gives me some confidence that my watering is probably not the problem.

The new shoots on my serissas seem to start to droop when they are getting close to dry so that may be another gauge to look for.

Good to know.

I'm a DIY guy so I prefer to develop my trees from scratch. That way I own all the mistakes as well as anything good. Plenty of people, including some very respected bonsai growers, who are happy to pay for tree that someone else has developed. I guess they just want to have something great without the hassle and time to grow it. Either way is fine

Thanks for sharing your perspective on this! It's super helpful to get so many people's opinions about it.

 

[FicusForager]

Hi, regarding your figs, you might want to watch this series. It's really useful.

Oh man, when he got out the saw my heart stopped but that's just because I am not confident enough to even think about doing such a big move like that right now and have faith that I could help it come back better. Super cool video though! I definitely want to watch the rest.

I'm in the UK and I put mine outside as soon as the weather allows. They protest for a few weeks (I get a bit of leaf scorch, so start them off in the shade), then they grow like weeds. Already have 2 feet to growth which I have cutback and am awaiting for the next flush. The trunks have almost doubled in size this year alone.

Good luck!

Oh my goodness this is crazy helpful! I am figuring out a good place for my outdoor set up as we speak. Doing periodic checks on my yard today to see how much sun different areas get. Don't want to scorch the crap out of my little guys. Do you think that I should wait to put them outside until next spring? Like is it too late in the growing season for them to get much benefit from outside time? Or would it still help? The goal is definitely to beef up my trunks a little bit. Anyone is welcome to respond to this!

 

[Nickuk74]

Oh man, when he got out the saw my heart stopped but that's just because I am not confident enough to even think about doing such a big move like that right now and have faith that I could help it come back better. Super cool video though! I definitely want to watch the rest.

Oh my goodness this is crazy helpful! I am figuring out a good place for my outdoor set up as we speak. Doing periodic checks on my yard today to see how much sun different areas get. Don't want to scorch the crap out of my little guys. Do you think that I should wait to put them outside until next spring? Like is it too late in the growing season for them to get much benefit from outside time? Or would it still help? The goal is definitely to beef up my trunks a little bit. Anyone is welcome to respond to this!

Haha - it was scary, but when I did it, the top rooted in water. It did nothing for a week, then grew so many roots over a weekend I was away. The cutting is actually better than the bottom bottom that was left.

As far as putting it out now, that would depend on your conditions. I would definitely advise shade though. My indoor bonsai are a bit of an experiment so I don't treat them as well as I should (as they can easily be replaced). If I were you I would get a few cheap Chinese Elm's to learn on. They are very forgiving, seem to be able to come back from the dead and you can make really good trees from pretty cheap starting material... Jelle has promised us a "Mallsai" (cheap bonsai trees from the Mall) video so keep an eye out for that!!

 

[rockm]

This is great advice! Combined knowledge base is very powerful.

I did mean website but instead I spent most of yesterday watching your youtube videos and they were incredibly helpful to me! Most of the questions I would have asked were actually answered in your videos. So thanks, Jelle!

One thing is I am curious about is what people's thoughts are on Boxwood trees for bonsai? My nursery has an amazing selection of them and I would love to take one home and style it (but following your videos' advice Jelle, I will not repot until the right season ).

Boxwood make excellent tough bonsai material. I have several. One is Kingsville boxwood a dwarf variety with extremely small leaves. The other is collected Japanese boxwood adapted from a shrub planted in the 1970s in hedge in Arlington Va. it was dug up and made into a bonsai about 15 years ago

fwiw your earlier thoughts about trees being “yours” only if you begin and grow them by yourself is a bit nearsighted and -forgive me- clueless. A little harsh-sorry, but at this point you don’t know what you don’t know.


One of the things you should keep in mind is that bonsai are NEVER “finished”. They evolve-sometimes dramatically- over the years. They don’t do that by themselves. The best are shaped and maintained by multiple people over decades and even centuries. One persons work is just a foundation. Working on older trees is more challenging than beginning trees. I’ve done both. Older trees are more challenging and offer more than trees just starting out.

 

[FicusForager]

Welcome, nothing to add really. Ficus cuttings root incredibly well so when pruning you can multiply your ficus very easy to get new trees.

Thanks for the welcome! And very good to know, I'm very fond of my ficuses so far, having more eventually sounds lovely Also, I like the horticulture section of your blog, I tried to do research in Box Elder bonsai and yours is waaay better looking than anything I saw in my googling lol.

 

[FicusForager]

Haha - it was scary, but when I did it, the top rooted in water. It did nothing for a week, then grew so many roots over a weekend I was away. The cutting is actually better than the bottom bottom that was left.

Oh wait was it you in the video?!?

As far as putting it out now, that would depend on your conditions. I would definitely advise shade though. My indoor bonsai are a bit of an experiment so I don't treat them as well as I should (as they can easily be replaced). If I were you I would get a few cheap Chinese Elm's to learn on. They are very forgiving, seem to be able to come back from the dead and you can make really good trees from pretty cheap starting material...

Rats, I have been searching for a chinese elm! The nursery I frequent doesn't have them which sucks. What they do have an abundance of is Zelkovas/Japanese Elms, would those be similar in temperament? Or are they crazy different?

Jelle has promised us a "Mallsai" (cheap bonsai trees from the Mall) video so keep an eye out for that!!

Ooooo don't tempt me with a good time. That sounds like it will be awesome!!

 

[leatherback]

Zelkovas/Japanese Elms

check .. They might just be chinese elms. BY far most of the zelkovas in trade are not zelkova at all.
If they are not refined and the leaves are not 1-2 inches, it is not a zelkova.

 

[leatherback]

Ooooo don't tempt me with a good time. That sounds like it will be awesome!!

nah, his videos are boring.