Turface Is The Worst?

[M. Frary]

You can order dry stall right online from the manu

We are not that remote. Rochester is a city of 200,000+. There is an Agway distributor in the area and I have contacted them, was told they would not (or could not, can't remember) get it in.

Have considered just ordering a pallet of pumice from somewhere out west (like Wee Tree) but I don't really have a good place to store 2000 pounds of pumice. If I could find a few people interested in splitting an order locally I'd do it in a second (it works out to be much cheaper, even with shipping, compared to ordering individual flate rate boxes)

Chris, you can order drys tall online from a place called animal world network. 40lbs. for under $12.00 didn't look up shipping. That's what's going to get you. You can also get a sample from the manufacturer.

 

[Rose Mary]

I get pumice and small red lava at a local nursery supply, they sell by the yard..cheap. they have all kinds of soil mixes, bark, sawdust etc. Check around or ask a landscape co where they get their materials.
I go pick up in a pickup and they load. Sift for the size you want.
Rose

 

[coh]

Thanks for the suggestion (referring to M. Frary). Shipping calculator says $50 per bag to my location, so $61 total. I can order and get 3.5 gallons of usable pumice for about $30, so this would have to yield 7 gallons to possibly make sense.

Anyone know how much usable product (in gallons, so it's easier to compare to the 3.5 gallon large flat rate boxes) you can get out of a bag? How's the particle size? I've heard it's somewhat on the small size.

Local nursery supply places around here don't stock things like pumice in bulk.

 

[Dav4]

I'll agree with Chris that Dry Stall is hard to source in the Northeast. Before moving out of MA, I called Agway to see if they could have some some Dry Stall shipped to a store near me. If I recall correctly, the closest bag they could find for me was in a store in Virginia...and the bag was ripped open. Even down here in GA, I've got to drive close to an hour to get to the nearest supplier.

 

[Redwood Ryan]

When I sift bags of pumice I get very little. I'll maybe be able to keep a fifth of the bag, if even that.

 

[coh]

When I sift bags of pumice I get very little. I'll maybe be able to keep a fifth of the bag, if even that.

Are you referring to bags of dry stall or something else?

 

[Redwood Ryan]

Are you referring to bags of dry stall or something else?

The bags of dry stall. Should've specified that.

 

[Redwood Ryan]

Long story short, $61 just for one bag wouldn't be worth it. I'd just buy it pre-sifted from somewhere online.

 

[Nybonsai12]

I had a tough time getting turface locally, much like most soil components. I've used it though and had issues with particle size being too small for other already small components of the mix. In addition I find using it in other capacities I end up getting dry spots, although there could be other contributing factors.
For now I use differing combos of pumice, lava, akadama and kiryu in different ratios/sizes depending on the tree. Trees seem happy thus far.

 

[bonhe]

I pulled some of new transplanted cork elm, JBP, tamarix out of their "rehab center" this morning. When I saw this cork elm, I just remember of this thread, so took some pictures. As I said, I don't buy turface any more, but I used whatever left. Besides using that in the mixture for small bonsai pots, I use it to cover the soil surface for all small pots to avoid disturbing surface during watering, and to give the aesthetic look, too.

Bonhe

 

[milehigh_7]

There is a pumice mine here in town that is owned by a cinder block company. I am going to chase that rabbit and see what I come up with.

 

[markyscott]

Thanks for the suggestion (referring to M. Frary). Shipping calculator says $50 per bag to my location, so $61 total. I can order and get 3.5 gallons of usable pumice for about $30, so this would have to yield 7 gallons to possibly make sense.

Anyone know how much usable product (in gallons, so it's easier to compare to the 3.5 gallon large flat rate boxes) you can get out of a bag? How's the particle size? I've heard it's somewhat on the small size.

Local nursery supply places around here don't stock things like pumice in bulk.

I'm not sure about the vendor M. Frary pointed you too, but I do have the cuts for Wee Tree - I split pallets of it with friends here in my area. I really suggest you go that way if you can - it comes in 50, 40 pound bags. I can usually find 4-5 people who are interested and we just split a pallet. Perhaps there are some nutters in you're area who are interested?

Anyway, it worked out to about 15 dollars a bag for both lava and pumice the last time I ordered from them - cheaper than I can get turface, especially when you start thinking about seiving for coarser size fractions - turface is 90% <1/8", which I discard as I don't use that size fraction. For lava, you might try Beam Clay. They're $375 per ton ($7.50/ bag) plus shipping. If you're on the east coast they might be the way to go - I looked into them once, but shipping from Jersey turned out to be high so I ordered the lava from Wee Tree too. They sell it by the bag also at $9.85 for a 40 pound bag plus shipping.

Here are the percentages by volume for different size fractions of pumice from Wee Tree:

1/2"-3/8" 29%
3/8"-1/4" 33%
1/4"-1/8" 27%
<1/8" 11%

I use everything larger than 1/8", so I only discard about 11%. For me it would be better if there was a higher fraction in the 3/8"-1/4" range.

Scott

 

[coh]

Thanks Scott. I had worked out all the pricing last year and was considering purchasing a pallet even though I hadn't identified anyone to split the cost. Figured there would be someone in the area who would want some. Definitely going to look into it further this year.

I do have a local source for beam clay (Hollow Creek Bonsai) and therefore can get it (and akadama) relatively cheap. But he (Hollow Creek) didn't want to order pumice.

Last time I ordered a couple of flat rate boxes of pumice from wee tree, I kept track of the fractions as you did. Have to see if I can find those notes...I do agree there was a bit more of the really small stuff than I would like but overall I do like the fact that you get a range of sizes.

Chris

 

[Bunjeh]

OK,..so I tripped over a local source for pumice and lava. Bonsai Northwest in Seattle sells 20 pound bags of 1/4" lava or 3/8 minus pumice for $16.00 (about 2 cubic feet). Still not throwing away my turface, however.

 

[markyscott]

OK,..so I tripped over a local source for pumice and lava. Bonsai Northwest in Seattle sells 20 pound bags of 1/4" lava or 3/8 minus pumice for $16.00 (about 2 cubic feet). Still not throwing away my turface, however.

Ahh, Bonsai Northwest. If I only had a dollar for every hour I spent in that place. But, it seems expensive for your neck of the woods. We're paying 1/2 that to get it shipped in from your area! If nothing else, the place we order it from is only a couple hour drive for you - pick it up and save the shipping. But I'm thinking you should be able to find a more local source - after all, you're living in the area where pumice is made!

Are you sure 20 pounds is 2 cubic feet? Seems awfully light. 40 pounds is about 1 cubic foot when I order it.

Scott

 

[Bonsai Nut]

50 pound bag of pumice is about $8 in Orange County if you swing by OC Farm Supply. Tell them you belong to the OC Bonsai Study Group and you will get an additional discount I'm not kidding.

 

[markyscott]

There you go. Road trip! I'm drivin to LA!

Scott

 

[markyscott]

Ok - I had to check my notes. It's been a long time since I was buying this stuff in Seattle. Here's a place that sells pumice for $22.85 for a 50L bag - that's almost 2 cubic feet:

http://www.indoorsun.com/Indoor_Sun_Shoppe/Soil.html

But the place I used to go mostly was T. E. Walrath Trucking in South Tacoma. They carried bulk pumice. You set up an appointment, then show up with a shovel!

Maybe they still do it.

Good luck
Scott

 

[ianb]

50 pound bag of pumice is about $8 in Orange County if you swing by OC Farm Supply. Tell them you belong to the OC Bonsai Study Group and you will get an additional discount I'm not kidding.

Yup, picked up 2 bags yesterday, $6.99 with the discount. I know you said it was large but at least the first bag is about 60% large (>6mm) and 40% small-medium, very little dust/waste too.

 

[markyscott]

I wonder how many bags if have to buy to pay for gas from Houston? Course, maybe I could sell them for $100/bag when I got back to get rich beyond my wildest dreams...

Scott